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Ogryn usefulness? some insight into a theory...Ogryn tactics...
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Old 08 May 2009, 00:31   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Ogryn usefulness? some insight into a theory...Ogryn tactics...

I know the Ogryn usefulness has been debated heatedly on multiple forums. I wished to put forth a possible use for such awesome models. Please note, this is my opinion, armies/tactics will vary. Ogryns are not "Lash Princes" or "Nob Bikers" they are not a non-brainer, but they do have a place, and I believe fill a role.

For roughly the cost of a Grey Knight Terminator, you get a three wound abhuman with low leadership, very short ranged shooting attacks, and paper armor. (But Dead Sexy Figures)

What use is such a model? You can't march them across the board, and a chimera limits them to six bodies with all of the above limitations. Leadership seven, even with stubborn is not going to last past the first or second round of a fight. Unsupported = they die.

Hmmmm, how about this,

Eight to ten Ogryns combined with Commissar Yarrick, positioned in front of your Heavy support (Leman Russses, griffons etc..)

You get an excellent counter assault unit, that is fearless, re-rolls failed to hits on the charge, is strength six on the charge, and can take all the lascannon/ melta gun shots that would normally strike your Heavy assets. Yes that's correct, your Leman russes would get a 4+ cover save from the Ogryns, and still be able to fire over them. Think of 30 wounds at toughness five, kinda makes you smile doesn't it, Those same thirty fearless wounds will lay the abhuman smack down on any squad that comes within twelve inches, after shooting them with thirty strength five assault shots of course.

Any drop pod fun that landed nearby (first turn) in addition to getting a demolisher hit from your Mystic assisted Inquisitor Ally, would have to shoot through your incredibly resilient Ogryns.

The way I see it, Ogryns strength is in hanging back, supported by and protecting your assets. Naturally this wouldn't apply to many variations of Guard lists that can be produced. But for semi-tank/artillery hoard Guard, I believe this would work. Yes I can hear the screams of ," Krumpa! almost 600 points of models, just standing there? they HAVE to earn their points back!"

To which I reply," Put ten Ogryns and Yarrick in front of your tanks and watch the metagame change."

Please feel free to offer any wisdom as to my write up....

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Old 08 May 2009, 00:35   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Ogryn usefulness? some insight into a theory...Ogryn tactics...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krumpa
(But Dead Sexy Figures)
This has to be a first! lol Ogryns sexy?!! :P
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Old 08 May 2009, 00:55   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Ogryn usefulness? some insight into a theory...Ogryn tactics...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anubis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krumpa
(But Dead Sexy Figures)
This has to be a first! lol Ogryns sexy?!! :P
Embrace the abhuman Love!
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Old 08 May 2009, 02:11   #4 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Ogryn usefulness? some insight into a theory...Ogryn tactics...

ill embrace them with a power fist and bolter :P hehe
I was always a fan of the models... I have a few of the older ones. The new guard models look pretty sweet tho tbh
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Old 08 May 2009, 02:14   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Ogryn usefulness? some insight into a theory...Ogryn tactics...

10 is too much to be honest. It's like having 10 Terminators (not so common but the points could be spent elsewhere). I'll take 4-6 as an optimal number for optimal efficiency.
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Old 17 Jul 2009, 14:31   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Ogryn usefulness? some insight into a theory...Ogryn tactics...

When the Imperial Guard faces an oppoent, usually there will be a unit in his army that is particularly shooty (like Devastators, Broadsides, Obliterators or simply massed Firewarriors) and thus poses a threat to Imperial Guard lines. Usually, this unit is hidden very well in cover, so they always get a coversave. So how to render them ineffective? You could of course, always pour an insane amount of firepower into them and try to destroy them in that way, but that firepower is best used elsewhere. Your other option is to deny them the use of their shooty weapons by locking them in close combat!

"But the IG has no assault units", the enemy will say. "They're just a static line of Guardsmen with crappy guns" This is where your Ogryns come into play!


I always tend to stick 3 Ogryns and a Bone'ead in a Chimera with smoke, heavy bolter and multi laser and first turn move 6'' and fire both weapons, second turn move 12'' and pop smoke, third turn ogryns get out, move, shoot and charge unscathed into the enemy and the chimera shoots both weapons again.

Due to 3 wounds, Ogryns need not fear plasma weapons like terminators do. There is no "lucky shot" that insta-kills ogryns except S10, but usually this comes from exotic and rare weapons that should actually be targeting your tanks - if they are targeting your ogryns, then your tanks will rejoice! The other S10 danger comes from a Demolisher cannon, being the only true Ogryn fear factor.

But most of the time your Ogryns will be esposed to small arms fire (needing 5s to wound) - and if you employ the tactic I showed above, your Ogryns will NOT be exposed to enemy fire AT ALL! They charge into close combat and will usually win, because the enemy shooty squad (usually 1 attack each) will struggle to wound them. Let's say the enemy is a 10 man Space Marine squad with a heavy and a special weapon, 30-40 points cheaper than our Ogryn squad: 10 attacks hitting first = 5 hits = 2 wounds, compared to Ogryns' seventeen S6 attacks on the (furious) charge, of which 8.5 will hit and roughly 6.5 will wound, which potentially mean 1-6 dead Space Marines, usually 1 and thus winning the close combat round.

And against enemy close combat specialists, your Guard's ranged weaponry should do. Don't expect Ogryns to tackle a Carnifex, Hive Tyrant, Avatar, Daemon Prince, C'tan, close combat Terminators, Grey Knight Terminators or other nasties...let your tanks do the killing for you here

+1 -AC
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Old 17 Jul 2009, 14:52   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Ogryn usefulness? some insight into a theory...Ogryn tactics...

Having faced off against a 6man ogryn squad on a regular basis, i can tell you that putting in the chimera and just charging across the table is lethal, even against close combat specialists, i would still see the ogrys come out on top, and against an equivilant squad of Black Templar Assault Terminators with TL Lightning Claws, when the Ogryns were on the charge, they killed the termies in 2 rounds of combat, losing only 3 guys. when the terminators charge, its the other way around. but dont count them out againt close combat specialists just yet.

I find the best way to beat them is with massed rapid fire markerlight guided Pulse fire. woulding an ogryn on a 4 is not to be sniffed at.
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Old 18 Jul 2009, 02:22   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Ogryn usefulness? some insight into a theory...Ogryn tactics...

Try out five with Yarrick and a Chimera. That will make for a tough surprise for those pesky Marime players. ;D
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Old 18 Jul 2009, 05:03   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Ogryn usefulness? some insight into a theory...Ogryn tactics...

If you've played this game for any amount of time, unsupported uints usually die horribly. Guard that goes double. Other than the assault with chimera described as above is the main way I see them used. the other way is in the static gun line as a counter unit. Enemy gets in close to try assaulting and either get charged by the ogryns after they engage a squad of guardsmen, or get hit by the Ogryn before they get the charge.
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Old 18 Jul 2009, 05:25   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Ogryn usefulness? some insight into a theory...Ogryn tactics...

I intend to add Ogryns to my army. I've always loved their models and fluff. They're so much funi n Dawn of War too!

My primary opponent plays Dark Angels. And I have no fear of him. Sure, if he gets any of his guys into hand to hand with my Guard I'm hurt. The Ogryns will offset that for me immensely. As for his army, I have no fear of it. My Guard army has substantial firepower and my better use of strategy and tactics give me an advantage over his Dark Angels. He compensates for bad tactics and strategy with numbers. His whole game is based on bringing as much to the battle as possible. As many units, specialists, etc. He's one of those players who goes overboard. Lacking significant tactical and strategic prowess is his weakness. I make the most with the least and am very good at formulating my plan, adjusting to changes in battle, as well as using tactics. He on the other hand seems unable to make a battle plan and seems only to actually plan when it is his turn. This limits him to always being a "reactionary" player who can't think of long term plans and several turns ahead.

I think adding a bunch of Ogryns to my army will make even more trouble for him. And of course his natural reaction will simply be to add a lot of whatever is best at killing the Ogryns. Which will of course work in my favor as I know how to exploit everything and counter things.
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