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Bassie tank destroyer.
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Old 25 Oct 2008, 03:03   #1 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Bassie tank destroyer.

Does anyone but me find the basilisk useful as a tank destroyer. I mean think about it str: 9 large blast TD for 115 pts ( armored crew compartment.).
I do it all the time and it works well if you hide it behind a building or something else.
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Old 25 Oct 2008, 05:52   #2 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Bassie tank destroyer.

Sorry, but bassies with A.C.C. cost 120, not 115.

But yes, they are amazing. My friend plays drop-pod marines, and nothing surpises him more than remembering basilisks are not JUST indirect fire.
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Old 25 Oct 2008, 13:16   #3 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Bassie tank destroyer.

It can be used in that capacity, certainly, but I don't think it's really the best tool for the job. In the given context what are you really getting? A Strength 9 ordnance weapon? The fact that it uses the large blast template is largely irrelevant against vehicles. Note also that Basilisks are difficult to hide and have paper thin armour. Worse yet, the fact that they roll on the vehicle damage table means that even a single bolt pistol shot could potentially render it useless! I'm not saying a lascannon-armed anti tank squad is an indestructible force of tank-slayage, but they're cheaper; have more than twice the firepower between them; can make better use of cover; and won't necessarily be taken out of the game the moment they start taking damage. They are in all respects a vastly superior tank hunting unit. Turn the Basilisk's gun on targets of opportunity if tasty vehicles roll into your sights and you've no better targets, but otherwise it really ought to be shelling heavily armoured infantry units. In the final analysis - The Basilisk is a poor choice as a dedicated tank hunter.
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Old 25 Oct 2008, 17:28   #4 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Bassie tank destroyer.

Quote:
It can be used in that capacity, certainly, but I don't think it's really the best tool for the job. In the given context what are you really getting? A Strength 9 ordnance weapon? The fact that it uses the large blast template is largely irrelevant against vehicles. Note also that Basilisks are difficult to hide and have paper thin armour. Worse yet, the fact that they roll on the vehicle damage table means that even a single bolt pistol shot could potentially render it useless! I'm not saying a lascannon-armed anti tank squad is an indestructible force of tank-slayage, but they're cheaper; have more than twice the firepower between them; can make better use of cover; and won't necessarily be taken out of the game the moment they start taking damage. They are in all respects a vastly superior tank hunting unit. Turn the Basilisk's gun on targets of opportunity if tasty vehicles roll into your sights and you've no better targets, but otherwise it really ought to be shelling heavily armoured infantry units. In the final analysis - The Basilisk is a poor choice as a dedicated tank hunter.
I agree with you over all however singularly lascannon and basilisk the basilisk has the ordanance roll two dice for armor penetration and choose the highest, so they are sorta better at killing tanks.
Well from an armor penetration view however pointwise id rather go with the 3 lascannons as well against tanks...
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Old 26 Oct 2008, 16:24   #5 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Bassie tank destroyer.

This is one of those cases where a unit works well at something its not designed for. Basilisks (I'm actually picking one up in an hour or two... Hello scratch-built Armageddon ACC ) are very capable of destroying tanks. However, as Tom said, they're not really useful for strict tank hunting.

I like to consider it in this fashion: Your Basilisk is going to have plenty of targets. I myself destroy my enemies units based on two factors:
1. Danger unit presents to my force
2. Probability that the unit can be destroyed

So, if I begin my turn with a Basilisk, a Vanquisher, a Hellhound, and a platoon with a healthy CC oriented Command Section, and I am facing a Space Marine army with two Tactical squads, a Vindicator, Veterans, and an Assault Squad, I need to make decisions.

If the Vindicator is within range of hitting my troops within the next turn or two, I will start by firing my Vanquisher cannon at it. If that misses, I may go for a missile launcher in one of my squads. Misses.

I'm now faced with a conundrum. The Vindicator is approaching fast, but I planned to fire my Basilisk at a deliciously tightly packed Veteran Squad across the board. If the Vindicator presents enough of a threat, I will fire upon that. If I feel confident either it will do little actual damage to my army as a whole, or not get lucky 'to hit' rolls, I'll go right ahead and wipe those Vets off the table.

I use my Basilisk as anti-tank really only in emergency situations, when my dedicated anti-tank fails me.

The Imperial Guard has more than enough anti-tank capability, between Heavy Weapon sections, melta-guns, and other tanks. You shouldn't have to use your Basilisk, but sometimes its necessary, and we all know it can do it well.

If you really want some great Anti-armor, do what I do... get a few Vanquisher turrets

Stankov
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Old 26 Oct 2008, 22:23   #6 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Bassie tank destroyer.

This is much like the Sturmgachutz German SPG (Self proppeled gun). The Germans were retreating, and in some cases, advancing faster than their artillery could keep up, and the other SPG's were too lightly armored. So the Sturmgachutz would come up and support the infantry (They were also great for moral thanks to propoganda.) They COULD take out tanks, but it's main task was to take out infantry. If the panzers were either not present, destroyed, occupied or well, missed, then the sturmgachutz is able to take a shot.

It's really about what's a bigger threat to your army, much like Tom said.
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Old 26 Oct 2008, 23:16   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Bassie tank destroyer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SmartSCrazy
I agree with you over all however singularly lascannon and basilisk the basilisk has the ordanance roll two dice for armor penetration and choose the highest, so they are sorta better at killing tanks.
Well from an armor penetration view however pointwise id rather go with the 3 lascannons as well against tanks...
I am well aware of that but it's irrelevant in this context. We're not comparing the lascannon to the earthshaker cannon because such a linear comparison is not useful in this case. If 120 points bought you only a single lascannon then you'd be right on the money (well, maybe...the scatter rules do rather tend to make the lascannon more likely to land a hit than an earthshaker), but the fact remains that you can have three lascannons for less than the price of a single earthshaker. Ultimately, this reality unequivocally disqualifies the Basilisk as a dedicated tank hunter. Even in terms of mobility, the Basilisk still can't compete with a pair of lascannon-toting Sentinels; it's just inferior for this isolated role.
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Originally Posted by Colonel_Sanders
When all was finished, the battlefield was a smoking crater. UDC, Valoran, US Army, Tau, the Nazis, a random pirate ship, and a bunch of ninjas, all were enemies to the Vulture. All were turned into scrap metal. Or plastic. Depends which game system you play.
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Old 05 Nov 2008, 06:40   #8 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Bassie tank destroyer.

I agree with Tom Norman on this one. I mean yeah the bassie has the POTENTIAL to hunt tanks if need be. But for the points you spend on it you could buy a number of other weapons which could do the job for you (ie 3 lascannons heavy weapons or other things). Yes the basilisk can blow up a tank if need be but leave dedicated tanking hunting duties to other units which are more suited for the task.
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Old 06 Nov 2008, 19:52   #9 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Bassie tank destroyer.

alright lets see this for a setup then , i was wondering about bassies myself ever since i saw the 3 packed bass for 105$ . i play everyweek against my friend . hes maining a daemon hunter army . greyknight + greykight termies. stormtrooper for anti tank and a dreadnought in the pack .

i usualy face problem when his greyknight come up to my face and chop me up . would the bassie be a good way to get rid of that problem ? . if i was to use indirect fire to try and hit things , i belive the way to play it is use scatter without modifying the result with my bs right ?
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Old 06 Nov 2008, 22:12   #10 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Bassie tank destroyer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shoke
alright lets see this for a setup then , i was wondering about bassies myself ever since i saw the 3 packed bass for 105$ . i play everyweek against my friend . hes maining a daemon hunter army . greyknight + greykight termies. stormtrooper for anti tank and a dreadnought in the pack .

i usualy face problem when his greyknight come up to my face and chop me up . would the bassie be a good way to get rid of that problem ? . if i was to use indirect fire to try and hit things , i belive the way to play it is use scatter without modifying the result with my bs right ?
No, Basilisks are a terrible unit to take against Grey Knights. Not only do they benefit from 'the shrouding' - making them harder to hit at range (with both direct and indirect fire) - they're geared for close quarters fighting, which means they'll be closing the distance in double-quick time. Worse yet, they have rather a penchant for teleportation.

AP3 pie plates aren't a bad tool for murdering Grey knights, and if you must have them, perhaps a Leman Russ would be a better choice? Indirect fire will avail you no real benefits against such and up-close-and-personal foe; so if you're going to be firing direct anyway, you might as well pick something with a little more armour.

To be honest though, I actually think this is another one of those times a Lascannon AT support squad would be a better choice. You've got to expect Grey Knight Termies to teleport in when fighting an army like that, so it might pay to have some AP2 hurtiness waiting for them. Positioned right, you can effectively dictate where they won't appear. Two Lascannon squads deployed with clear line of sight to one another can serve as an effective firebase for combating advancing Grey Knight squads and vehicles, while also dissuading teleport attacks on your rear fire support lines. Grey Knight Terminators are damned expensive, and most people don't want to throw them away in suicide attacks.

Hardened Veterans/Storm Troopers with plasma guns are also a fine way to dispatch heavily armoured models.
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