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Doctrine help
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Old 03 Jun 2008, 18:04   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Doctrine help

Are doctrines really worth it?
In my army i have equiped my guardsmen squads with light infantry and sharpshooters. However it takes each squad avg. total up to 80pts without upgrades. My question is are equipping guardsmen with these doctrines really worth it?
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Old 03 Jun 2008, 19:58   #2 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Doctrine help

Guh...the cycle continues. :

Well, I'm going in...

Doctrines are not 'upgrades'. They are there to lend great flexibility to the IG army list, thus allowing you to represent any facet of the infinitely complex Imperial Guard. They are supposed to be chosen to suit the specific traits and characteristics you want your army to posess. If you select them in order to make your army in some way 'better' then don't look now, but you're a powergamer. If you select free doctrines that provide only benefits and no drawbacks, then you are the most contemptible kind of powergamer.

Doctrines add depth to armies beyond the visual aspect. They cannot be 'worth it' because if you treat them like upgrades you're missing the point.
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Old 03 Jun 2008, 21:21   #3 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Doctrine help

hey Tom, you should set up a sticky topic for these sort of questions. but i must say, you were complaining about answering these kinds of questions, you could just leave others to it and save yourself the hassle.

also Tom, on a picky note, he was saying that they cost 80pts without upgrades, as in different weapon set ups and sergeants. i would say take a break, have a rest, but your back from one.
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Old 04 Jun 2008, 03:21   #4 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Doctrine help

Embrace your power gaming self, and take close order drill, I say!

Honestly, there are several good combos...what are you trying to do? sharpshooters is best if you're pouring lascannons at squads...as frankly, if you stay with just lasguns and such, you'd be better off simply fielding more men. I dont imagine that those two doctrines are particularly synergistic...though you certainly could use them if you really like the idea.
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Old 04 Jun 2008, 03:25   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Doctrine help

I think we should tell him the 5th Edition is getting rid of doctrines and maybe playing a non-doctrine army ain't so bad also except when using it for alternative organization like Drop Troop and Mechanized and restricted troops like Storm Troopers etc.
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Old 04 Jun 2008, 03:27   #6 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Doctrine help

Good point. I wouldnt build an army based around a doctrine atm...though frankly, stuff like sharpshooters doesnt really affect composition much.

Best thing with sharpshooters doctrine is it allows you to play higher point games than your quantity of troops would normally allow.
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Old 04 Jun 2008, 11:38   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Doctrine help

Like Tom said, Doctrines aren't meant to be upgrades, they aren't meant to define your armies background. This doesn't mean you can't use them as such though.

Power gaming, or playing to win, is looked down upon by people who design their armies around their fluff. If you are playing to win, it is only natural for other games to belittle you since in most cases you will crush their army with ease.

There is nothing wrong with power gaming. If you want to use doctrines as upgrades, go right ahead.
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Old 04 Jun 2008, 12:04   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Doctrine help

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc [messyart
link=topic=67410.msg956688#msg956688 date=1212528109]
hey Tom, you should set up a sticky topic for these sort of questions. but i must say, you were complaining about answering these kinds of questions, you could just leave others to it and save yourself the hassle.

also Tom, on a picky note, he was saying that they cost 80pts without upgrades, as in different weapon set ups and sergeants. i would say take a break, have a rest, but your back from one.
I did leave others to it. But hell, I've taken a break and now I'm back for a bit, so why not?

[hr]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallessian
Like Tom said, Doctrines aren't meant to be upgrades, they aren't meant to define your armies background. This doesn't mean you can't use them as such though.

Power gaming, or playing to win, is looked down upon by people who design their armies around their fluff. If you are playing to win, it is only natural for other games to belittle you since in most cases you will crush their army with ease.

There is nothing wrong with power gaming. If you want to use doctrines as upgrades, go right ahead.
There is most definitely something wrong with powergaming. There's nothing wrong with aiming to win, but there's a line you shouldn't cross. People don't like one-sided battles when they're on the losing side (in fact even being on the winning side gets boring), and if you play ruthlessly; nitpicking rules; casting fluff aside and picking whatever will win battles, then no one will want to play against you twice. Wargamers call it powergaming; other sports call it 'poor sportsmanship'. It's about character, integrity and the spirit of the game, and if you honestly don't think there's anything wrong with that then I'd say that's more your problem than mine.
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Originally Posted by Colonel_Sanders
When all was finished, the battlefield was a smoking crater. UDC, Valoran, US Army, Tau, the Nazis, a random pirate ship, and a bunch of ninjas, all were enemies to the Vulture. All were turned into scrap metal. Or plastic. Depends which game system you play.
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Old 04 Jun 2008, 12:12   #9 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Doctrine help

And fortunately the doctrines are very interchangable. I could never see them becoming so all-consuming that an army is worthless without them. They're fluff, though many of them are useful and fun to incorporate.
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Old 04 Jun 2008, 13:50   #10 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Doctrine help

it is very unfair battling when you know that you can't lose. it's not near as fun. for either player really, it's like playing GTA games with cheats. i realised it's so much better without them.
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