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Hardened Veteran weapon mix
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Old 26 Jan 2007, 14:11   #1 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Hardened Veteran weapon mix

I am thinking about restructuring my using grenadiers as troops, and using three units of hardened veterans.

I am not sure of a good mix of weapons for the vets. I was wondering how y’all kit out your vets?

Thanks
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Old 26 Jan 2007, 14:31   #2 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Hardened Veteran weapon mix

i dont actually play guard but i have played against them quite a lot, one combination i fear heavily is 3 plasma guns and lascannon. As a Chaos player all that bs4 ap2 weaponry can cause a serious amount of hurt....

Of course there is always the chance of the plasma guns overheating, but thats all part of the fun ;D

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Old 26 Jan 2007, 14:31   #3 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Hardened Veteran weapon mix

I use my veterans with three plasmaguns and a lascannon. I infiltrate into cover, on one flank and gives the opponent hell.
A second squad is infiltrated out of LOS, armed with three meltaguns. If a tank or something heavy comes by, they pop out and hammer it.
Also, these squads has a great psychological effect. They are reasonably hard to take down, and hands out lots of hurt.
The best thing with Hardened Veterans is that not only are they strong, but they are also cheap as dirt.
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Old 26 Jan 2007, 15:56   #4 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Hardened Veteran weapon mix

Whatever you do, IMO, don't put flamers/grenade launchers on there, if so you coulda just got stormtroopers for a bit more and used the Hellgun instead of a flashlight. Which leaves you with melta/plas, and both are decent for High toughness/high armor enemies or vehicals. Depends on the rest of your list and what niche you need to fill.
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Old 26 Jan 2007, 17:58   #5 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Hardened Veteran weapon mix

I'd go 3 meltas and plasma pistol or 3 plasma, plasma pistol and a lascannon.
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Old 26 Jan 2007, 18:05   #6 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Hardened Veteran weapon mix

3 meltas and a autocannon/lascannon (depending on the average armor of your opponent) - take advantage of that BS. infiltrate, and die after smashing something huge.

I never leave my vets with lasguns because 2 shot shotguns with infiltration and a big BS are just too damn awesome to pass up

if you want to dump the points into it, i think the ideal veteran squad would look something like this:

1 sarge w honorifica / powerfist
3 meltguns
1 autocannon team
5 shotgunners

that squad can take a beating, and smash just about anything you set your mind to.

DONT GIVE THEM PLASMA! (unless you go with the carapace armor approach) you will be blowing yourself up more often than you blow someone else. when you have only 2-in-6 chance of missing, and no better armor than regular infantry - you will die almost every time you miss. this just seems like a waste to me... give the plas to stroopers or completely expendable troops and give the veterans m-guns instead.

a cheap points vet squad could be effective with 5 guys, 3 GrenLunches, and 2 shotgunners - but it is wise to cough up the points for a stormbolter for sarge - there isnt much meat in there but it is a very fluid move-n-shoot oriented squad and not too expensive.

74 points for the cheap 5-man squad with grenlunches and a stormbolt... this squad will annoy and provide a psychological threat, and is best used dodging around out of LOS and effective just to keep your opponent from moving where he wants because he will be scared that your 1-shot vet squad will jump out and kill something far more valuable than themselves.

185 for the sicko 10-man squad with the meltas, lascan, and honor sarge/powerfist that will slaughter anything you point it at.

it is ridiculously pointsy but they will define your game. if you want to go crazy with the vets you can give them carapace armor and cameleoline just to annoy your opponent that much more.
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Old 27 Jan 2007, 18:38   #7 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Hardened Veteran weapon mix

The way I was thinking of using the vets; was to use their infiltration ability to deny good positions for the opponent and get optimal kill zones for heavy weapons.

Since my troop slot will only have the grenadiers functioning as an armored fist unit. I am a little worried about having enough heavy weapons, since they will not be imbedded in the troops selections.
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Old 27 Jan 2007, 21:19   #8 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Hardened Veteran weapon mix

Quote:
Originally Posted by Centurion
3 meltas and a autocannon/lascannon (depending on the average armor of your opponent) - take advantage of that BS. infiltrate, and die after smashing something huge.

I never leave my vets with lasguns because 2 shot shotguns with infiltration and a big BS are just too damn awesome to pass up

if you want to dump the points into it, i think the ideal veteran squad would look something like this:

1 sarge w honorifica / powerfist
3 meltguns
1 autocannon team
5 shotgunners

that squad can take a beating, and smash just about anything you set your mind to.

DONT GIVE THEM PLASMA! (unless you go with the carapace armor approach) you will be blowing yourself up more often than you blow someone else. when you have only 2-in-6 chance of missing, and no better armor than regular infantry - you will die almost every time you miss. this just seems like a waste to me... give the plas to stroopers or completely expendable troops and give the veterans m-guns instead.

a cheap points vet squad could be effective with 5 guys, 3 GrenLunches, and 2 shotgunners - but it is wise to cough up the points for a stormbolter for sarge - there isnt much meat in there but it is a very fluid move-n-shoot oriented squad and not too expensive.

74 points for the cheap 5-man squad with grenlunches and a stormbolt... this squad will annoy and provide a psychological threat, and is best used dodging around out of LOS and effective just to keep your opponent from moving where he wants because he will be scared that your 1-shot vet squad will jump out and kill something far more valuable than themselves.

185 for the sicko 10-man squad with the meltas, lascan, and honor sarge/powerfist that will slaughter anything you point it at.

it is ridiculously pointsy but they will define your game. if you want to go crazy with the vets you can give them carapace armor and cameleoline just to annoy your opponent that much more.
I'd not recommend that "ideal" squad.
You stick a heavy weapon into a squad tooled up for assault. It would not be of much use. Also, the meltaguns are good, but the range impairs them quite a bit. By infiltrating them, you make them very vulnerable. And it is even worse that they are wearing T-shirts. Perhaps, you get a save if you stick them in cover. But even so, they would surely be out of reach with their weapons.

And sticking a Honorifica Imperialis on a simple veteran sargeant? No way. That is a lot of points which would be better spent elsewhere. That would also go for the Power Fist. You have one single model worth 58 points alone, and that is just not favourable. Also consider the low(average) toughness and bottom initiative together with the Flak armour save.
Suicide squads are supposed to be cheap. This is just overtooled.

But no Plasma? They might not be the same level of tankbusters as the meltaguns. But they have a good range, with a high strength low ap weapon. Even marines fear such a squad. I have no count on how many squads of MEQs/TEQs I have decimated with a simple squad of six Plasma-vets.

Shotguns would be OK with a small meltasquad for support, but not for anything else.

Do Hardened Veterans count as Infantry as they are Elites? Could I give them special equipment? (Not sure on that point...)
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Old 28 Jan 2007, 11:46   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Hardened Veteran weapon mix

It sound's like you need antitank support.. and then you should go for the las-plas squad. If you go for three plasmaguns you you need a slightly larger squad to account for the casaulties due to overheating. If you take out a vechile in a volley you will earn your points back. A small squad with one lascannon and one plasma can on the other hand be easier to hide on the battlefield. Mabe you should to one larger squad and one smaller.
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Old 30 Jan 2007, 12:42   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Hardened Veteran weapon mix

[[[ I have three Hardened vets sqds, one with 3xplasma+Lascannon(Coil-gun)
Get them someplace nice and covered, and launch hell at them!

the other also likes cover, but also to move so I will likely drop the HB and leave them with 3xmeltas, pistols and CCW's

My best sqaud is with a Honorifica Vet Sgt.+Plasma pistol+Powerwpn, add in 3xMeltas, CCW+Pistols, and all sneak about, and in C.o.D, I use them with the Sewer Rat strategem, making an AC player I know curse and hate them!
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