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meltabombs, krak grenades, and the people who love them
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Old 30 Aug 2006, 19:41   #1 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default meltabombs, krak grenades, and the people who love them

i am toying around with an army idea i have had for quite some time, but as i have not assembled most of it, i cant try it out. its a light infantry company with no armor support, every squad has a snip rifle, and every squad has a demo charge, and has a veteran sgt with meltabombs. saboteurs. everybody infiltrates, and everybody is a potential tank killer krak grenade packing lunatic.

i recently read a book about infantry anti-tank capabilities and some of the innovations such as I.E.D.s, roadside bombs, and similar easily portable explosives used in iraq for the last few years to stymie much more expensive high tech fighting vehicles and i got some ideas for using such an approach in 40k.

lacking ANY actual heavy weapons (i dont count snips as 'heavy&#39 - i want the cool theme of kind of a force-recon meets underequipped desperate but inventive rebels 'red dawn' kind of thing. i would throw in a lot of shartshooters, grenade launchers, hard fighters, die hards, and other upgrades to represent their hardcoreyness - but i worry that i will just get obliterated by any vehicle heavy force if not for the meltabombs and demo charges.

has anyone tried this approach? or hordes of krak grenades for infantry squads for similar effect? i dont want to go modelling a bunch of grenade packing soldiers if it is considered a complete waste of points and a hopelessly undergunned army - but i am intrigued by this alternative aproach to anti-armor battles.

i know GW designers dont always think very hard about the relative points value of their models, is a krak grenade or demo charge on a grunt guardsman worth xx points? or a meltabomb vetsarge?
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Old 30 Aug 2006, 19:49   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: meltabombs

Dont'Upgrade a unit with a demo charge,There's a 40% or so chance of killing them selves,Use demo charges on special wepon squads.

Also meltas arn't that good at anti-vehicle work when normal troops weild them(jump pack or better works fine).But in guard case,not that good. Krack grenades are the worst upgrades ever(exept for hell gun on an inqusitor)they work at strgth-6 wich is'nt that good if you lose 20 men getting to that rino(other cheap vehicle).

Try missle luancher,it's an RPG(like the armageden one).


An all grenade force would be good in a city fight i think but guard can't deal with armor without shooting.
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Old 30 Aug 2006, 22:36   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: meltabombs, krak grenades, and the people who love them

If you're going to use meltabombs, put them on rough rider squads. It's pretty funny when your 60 point squad blows up a 160 point tank, and it's not terribly difficult to do. You can take two squads for cheap, and after they meltabomb they're stuff useful on the charge.
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Old 30 Aug 2006, 22:58   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: meltabombs, krak grenades, and the people who love them

The only unit that can take a Demolition Charge is a Special Weapon squad...and it's the only squad that should ever even have them, if you want to go down the suicide team route.
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Old 31 Aug 2006, 00:26   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: meltabombs, krak grenades, and the people who love them

Well if you play catachans any model with access to the armoury can have them as it puts demo charges into the armoury. Only problem is they dont give a cost but i use the 10 points it costs for an assault squad.
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Old 31 Aug 2006, 17:23   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: meltabombs, krak grenades, and the people who love them

thanks for the advice guys. what if the squads were just upgraded with a vsgt with Mbombs, throw in a specweap democharge team in the command section and pray to the gods of averages that they dont blow themselves up... (can you put 3 in 1 squad? i was led to believe there was a 1 limit but that may be a myth) as I have no codex around i will take your word for it that the demo charges have to go in specweap squads and i only use codex guard, so all that catachan democharge stuff is out of the question.

i figure the vetsgt could be useful in his own right, not just for the meltabombs, but he could lug a bolter around, or a bolt/plas pistol, or a frag grenade if they need to assault into cover, so i dont have to get the whole squad the frags, plus there is that whole LD thing which is a minor boon but a boon nonetheless (there is a noticable difference between rolling 7 and rolling 8 with 2d6).

i guess the interpreetation of your mutual advice is:
dont upgrade a whole squad to krak grenades because they are lame
put your demo charges where they belong because normal guard infantry squads are not allowed to requisition them

so i answer, maybe a Vet Sgt heavy army with Mboms and specweap squads full of demo charges hope to contend with armor? it would be nice to see some undergunned infantry take out a mechanized force. there has to be some way to do this!

i cannot add missile launchers or other obvious anti-tank choices right now, the biggest guns i have are grenade launchers, so i want to try a different approach. there must be a way.

any ideas are helpful
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Old 31 Aug 2006, 18:44   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: meltabombs, krak grenades, and the people who love them

I'd be concerned about the viability of such a strategy (meltabombs on the vet) against any marginally competent player. You lack any way to get close to a vehicle, which will just drive off. If you want to go down this route, you need some way to get close enough to a vehicle that doesn't want you near it.

Meltabombs are ok, if used in a squad. I don't think they're worth it alone - you get one attack. If the vehicle moved even a little, you've got a 50% chance to miss - if it moves more than 6" (or is a skimmer), you're looking at 1/6 odds to hit. At least with a squad, you get more chances to make up the difference.

A priest with an evicerator can cut up a vehicle pretty well - 3 attacks charging at 6 + 2d6.

Perhaps hardened veteran sergeants with powerfists? It's only s6 though, so heavy armour is still a problem, but if you're getting up close&personal anyway, getting to the rear of a vehicle might not be so hard...
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Old 01 Sep 2006, 11:59   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: meltabombs, krak grenades, and the people who love them

I may be missing something but what on terra do krak grenades do?

in the current rulebook there's nothing on them apart for assaulting vehicles
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Old 02 Sep 2006, 00:56   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: meltabombs, krak grenades, and the people who love them

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I may be missing something but what on terra do krak grenades do?

in the current rulebook there's nothing on them apart for assaulting vehicles
yup... its in a little sidebar somewhere. thats the only place they are mentioned. and that's all they do.

medium str hit on vehicle you assault - not that great i know, but with enough of them and since if your infantry are assaulting a vehicle the chance is you will get a few side and rear positions, they just might work. in and of itself it is not a bad weapon for the cheapness...

but as the guys have pointed out, the problem isnt in using them - just getting them next to a vehicle at infantry move speeds is a difficult challenge. same with Melt bombs but they hit harder. neither is a particularly good investment given the slim chance of survival of a guard infantry squad trying to chase down even a light vehicle. i think they are nice for fluffiness, or in 'hidden army' games where your opponent doesnt know what you are armed with except by looking at figures... i remember the look on seans face as i charged his railhead with about 15 guys and he said in disbelief :"you gave ALL YOUR SQUADS krak grenades??!! oh <poop>!" and for once they did their job, only because he was charging up on me trying to take the objective, and not worrying about such little things because of forums like this where people are given to assume that nobody uses krak grenades as common knowledge.
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Old 02 Sep 2006, 10:30   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: meltabombs, krak grenades, and the people who love them

that little side bar is also for assaulting units and krak greades do nthing there- so why bother buying them?
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