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Shooty Army List (1500 points)
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Old 14 Jan 2006, 09:20   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Shooty Army List (1500 points)

I present to you, the 1st T'ros Gue'la Cadre! (Motto: "Never bring a knife to a gunfight.")

First, a few comments. This is intended to represent a Tau-aligned human force, so there are certain options that I'm avoiding because I don't think they'd be appropriate. In particular, close combat: apart from a single power fist, there isn't a close combat weapon to be seen in the entire list. I suppose I could flex this rule a bit more, but I'd really like to avoid a tooled-up assaulty command squad.

Commissars seem a bit inappropriate for a non-Imperial force, but hopefully the vox-net will make an adequate replacement for them. Official Imperial cultists like priests and techpriests are probably out, as are psykers (without an established system for training them). Carapace armour, however, is right on - I can make it out of fire warrior bitz. I might have gone with it as a doctrine if I didn't want normal flak armour on some models for them to double as human auxiliaries in a Tau army. The grenadiers doctrine is a sort of compromise.

Speaking of doctrines, I'm taking two - grenadiers, and drop troops. The models I plan to drop are the hardened veterans (for melta goodness) and the Mars-pattern sentinels (for many shots at weak rear armour). I'll probably fork out the extra for forgeworld Elysian models for these units - I'll see how I go.

Please comment, criticise, compliment, etc. In particular, let me know if I can get away with only one tank - or even scrap it altogether. Now, without further ado, the army:

[tt]HQ:

Command Platoon
Command Squad (HSO with bolter) (lasguns; master-vox; standard bearer) 107
Anti-Tank Squad (3 lascannons) 110
Anti-Tank Squad (3 lascannons) 110
327

Elites:

Hardened Veterans
10 Hardened Veterans (shotguns; 3 meltaguns; vox) 155
(incl. vet sergeant with power fist, trademark item, melta bomb)


Troops:

Infantry Platoon
Command Squad (JO with bolter, surveyor) (missile launcher; lasguns; vox) 63
Infantry Squad (missile launcher; vox) 80
Infantry Squad (missile launcher; vox) 80
Infantry Squad (missile launcher; vox) 80
303
Infantry Platoon
Command Squad (JO with bolter, surveyor) (heavy bolter; lasguns; vox) 58
Infantry Squad (heavy bolter; vox) 75
Infantry Squad (heavy bolter; vox) 75
208
Stormtroopers
10 Stormtroopers (2 grenade launchers; vox) 240
(incl. vet sergeant with storm bolter, surveyor)
(incl. Chimera with 2 heavy bolters; heavy stubber; extra armour; smoke; searchlight)


Fast Attack:

Sentinel (multilaser; HK missile; searchlight) 56

Sentinel (multilaser; HK missile; searchlight) 56


Heavy Support:

Leman Russ (3 heavy bolters) 155

Army Total: 1500[/tt]
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Old 14 Jan 2006, 09:39   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Shooty Army List (1500 points)

Ouuuch, right off the bat. Boo for the lascannons in anti-tank squads! Anti-tank squads in general are asking to get shot at a lot and lascannons are the worst being the most expensive, and one of the juciest targets. Without a wall of guard flesh guarding them, those are sure to die, and fast.

Everything else I like. I'd swap out ML in the infantry platoons for lascannons, and put those MLs in the anti-tank squad instead, or you could do something like add another infantry squad, do one platoon with MLs another with Lascannons and do a fire support squad for your heavy bolters? That way your uber weapons are protected by walls of meat and the heavy bolters that are separated are much less juicy. That change should probably keep you at around the same point cost if you so choose.

The lone tank is sure to be a prime target for every AT weapon in the enemy army (so is the stormtrooper chimera now that I think about it). If I wanted to make this list more effective all around I'd change it so stormtroopers are also deepstriking with meltas or somethin, or infiltrating with plasmas, I don't know, dropping the russ and adding in more stormtroopers, more infantry, more vets, whatever. I think an all infantry/sentinel force with drop troops (as much as I don't like it) is still more effective than infantry and such with the lone tank support at 1500. But I do love the battlecannon.
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Old 14 Jan 2006, 10:11   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Shooty Army List (1500 points)

I would replace one lascannon squad with more heavy bolters or autocannons, and the other with more ML or autocannons. I would give the stormtroopers plasma or melta, so that there will seem to be a point to them riding out to the enemy. Grenade launchers arent worth a chimera.

Voxes are always an adequate replacement for Commissars. Unless they are leading some conscripts, Commissars are too expensive for what they do.

I would probably scrap the tank for more guard. I do like the idea of dropping the sentinels to attack rear armor with multilasers. Most people underestimate this weapon.
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Old 14 Jan 2006, 13:23   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Shooty Army List (1500 points)

I agree with Akthomas89 on this. Switch some weapons around. hide the lascannons in the infantry squads and put the heavy bolters in the command section. One more reason, besides the safety, is that 3 lascannons in one heavy weapon squad all have to shoot at the same target, where often 1 would do the job just fine. If they aren't all in the same squad, you can call your shots 1 by 1, if the first one misses, fire the second, if the second one hits, you blow something up and can still fire the third at a different target.
I am skeptical of those chimera assigned stormtroopers. That thing is just asking to be hit with a lot of fire, killing the tank and the expensive squad inside pretty easy. I would drop it to a five man kill squad with deep strike or infiltrate as you prefer but keep all the special weapons. The 5 extra hellgun shots don't really do much and cost a lot. either reassign the chim or drop it entirely - you can probably squeeze in a tank for the points saved by switching your HW around, getting rid of a few redundant storm troopers, and then your Chimera can evolve into a Leman or a Hound (if you have the models, which I know is a lot to assume).
I like the heavy weapon approach. We stick with what we do best. It's not a bad army at all, but if you fine tune it a bit you'll have a really good army. Still dice are dice

---
Mr.Wargamer just posted after me and reminded me of something I was thinking while reading your list, but forgot to mention as I got into typing. But I didnt want to double post so quickley, so I'll just tack it on here:
---
hunter killer missiles? yeah. very pointsy and not very useful. It's cute to tack on to a flamer armed chim or sentinel just to catch people off guard, or if your army fluff revolves around really pimped out vehicles, but it's just unnecessary if you are fine-tuning a heavy weapon army.
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Old 14 Jan 2006, 13:32   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Shooty Army List (1500 points)

This is entirely personal preference, but that Russ strikes me as odd. I personally would give it Extra Armour to keep it mobile (which it can be, with those Heavy Bolters), or strap on a hull-lascannon so it can threaten armour and high toughness/save enemies when it loses the battlecannon. I like my Russ to be able to take on everything.

I wouldn't give Lascanons to the Heavy Weapon Squad, it's just far too tempting. Put them in Infantry squads, where there's lots of cannon fodder. Missile Launchers can go into the HW squads instead.

Personally, I don't like HKs. They are a one-shot wonder, and aren't accurate enough to be worth the points... of course, that's my opinion. If you actually get them to work (and I don't... they never hit for me!) then good luck with them.
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Old 14 Jan 2006, 21:02   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Shooty Army List (1500 points)

i agree with wargamer on the HKs. the only uses i see is for extra tank killingness for a deepstriking sentinel or if you absolutly have to kill a tank(or marine) in the first turn.
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Old 14 Jan 2006, 23:39   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Shooty Army List (1500 points)

Thanks for the feedback, everyone.

Normally I'd agree about the HK missiles, but in this case they should be shooting at rear armour (from the deep-striking sentinels). I think that makes them worthwhile, although they're certainly droppable if I need to scrape 20 points from somewhere.

The anti-tank squads should be in the best cover I can find, with re-rollable Ld 9 from the nearby command squad to keep them in place, but at the end of the day they're still 6 guardsmen worth 18 points each - a juicy target. Downgrading them to autocannons or missile launchers leaves them worth 16 points per model, which is still twice as much as my basic infantry. Maybe I should just scrap them entirely, and bulk up the infantry platoons.

As it currently stands, the stormtrooper squad is meant to dismount and provide mobile 24' firepower wherever it's needed, mounting up to race off and claim objectives in the last turn (if both they and the chimera survive). I could give them meltaguns and have them charge across the table instead, forcing the enemy to shoot at AV12 (with smoke launchers) or eat a couple of melta shots. (If so, I'd probably switch the chimera to carry heavy flamers instead.) The command squads could be equipped to fulfil the stormtroopers' original role, with storm bolters and grenade launchers.

After the comments that the Russ gathered, I think I'll drop it for a couple more squads of infantry. That should leave the enemy's anti-tank weapons with nothing to do, provided that the chimera can hide for a turn or two.
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Old 16 Jan 2006, 04:19   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Shooty Army List (1500 points)

In my IG-inexperieced opinion, I would swap out two of the three lascannons in each AT squad for a missile launcher for added versatility. Beyond that, I'd say it looks good.
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Old 16 Jan 2006, 15:38   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Shooty Army List (1500 points)

I'd swap out the vetrans shotguns for lasguns.

While the shotgun is a totally badass weapon thats loads of fun they just aren't practical for a drop troop squad, since you can't assault the turn you land, but you can still fire 2 shots at 12".

So by switching those shotguns to lasguns you become more versatile because that squad will either deepstrike within 12" of an enemy and a) shoot it and get charged the next turn, or b) shoot the enemy and chase it off, so they can shoot a more distant target next turn.

Also if you're getting the FW Elysian drop troops they come with the absolutley stunning bullpup lasguns. They look so incredibly cool, I think i'm actually in love with them...

I mean...

Yeah I stand by what I said...
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Old 16 Jan 2006, 21:29   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Shooty Army List (1500 points)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Abanim
Speaking of doctrines, I'm taking two - grenadiers, and drop troops. The models I plan to drop are the hardened veterans (for melta goodness) and the Mars-pattern sentinels (for many shots at weak rear armour). I'll probably fork out the extra for forgeworld Elysian models for these units - I'll see how I go.
you could always infiltrate the Vets and Scout the Sentinels though...
check out the Forgeworld Cadian Vets with shotguns- very cool
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