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IMPERIAL TANKS
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Old 05 Jan 2006, 02:01   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default IMPERIAL TANKS

now i dont know to much about the imperials but me personally, i think they use their tanks always its the only way they win its a fact i versed a guard player the other day 2 leman russ 1 demolisher 2 hellhounds ITS ANNOYING! and their way to cheep.
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Old 05 Jan 2006, 02:40   #2 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: IMPERIAL TANKS

Every army can field some extremely tough units. Which is why they are (deservedly) fire magnets. I actually find my Hammerheads, with weaker armour, survive longer than my Leman Russes because they are able to avoid enemy fire better.

While it is possible to cheese up an army list with tough units, it always comes at the cost of fewer models. The result is that you are able to concentrate your firepower. Playing Tau I can beat these lists with mobility. With guard it's pure numbers: more guys, more guns. Just as every list has tough units, every list has big guns.

Don't be frustrated, instead see how your army can be used to clean up his armour. I promise it is possible. And with guard, the only really tough units are those few tanks.
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Old 05 Jan 2006, 02:48   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: IMPERIAL TANKS

:Thanks allot mate i really appreciate what u said and thankyou for the help it will come in handy next time i verse him cause now i know what im doing thankyou again YES! guard prepare to DIE!
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Old 05 Jan 2006, 04:11   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: IMPERIAL TANKS

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brood_Lord
now i dont know to much about the imperials but me personally, i think they use their tanks always its the only way they win its a fact.
That's not true at all. Now while I'm trying not to blow up here,I will try to prove my point.
Most (good) imperial guard players do not rely on their tanks to win a battle. Unless you're playing Mechanized or Armored Company, in which it's a different matter altogether. Even those lists are compromised because they rely mostly on tanks to do the work, and if you remove the armor they should go quick. So don't go ranting after you learn how good IG tanks are the hard way, please just ask for advice on killing them. We'll gladly give it to you if you ask the nice way, which you didn't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brood_Lord
and their way to cheep.
Take a look at the cost of the tank without cumpolsory or non-cumpolsory weaponry, then look at the price of a no-upgrade infantry platoon, with squads maximized. That's 55 men right there, and still at least 50 pts. less than the Leman Russ. Tanks are not cheap.
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Old 05 Jan 2006, 04:21   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: IMPERIAL TANKS

Well you have me their but lately i have seen allot of guard players reliying on their tanks to win battles i know it might not be u who's doing that but im trying to get the point across that most guard players relly on their tanks without them their weak trust me after 10 years of 40k and over 10000 battles i do know wat im talking about
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Old 05 Jan 2006, 04:30   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: IMPERIAL TANKS

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brood_Lord
Well you have me their but lately i have seen allot of guard players reliying on their tanks to win battles i know it might not be u who's doing that but im trying to get the point across that most guard players relly on their tanks without them their weak trust me after 10 years of 40k and over 10000 battles i do know wat im talking about

With all due respect, if your going to lie, at least make it semi-belivable. :
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Old 05 Jan 2006, 04:35   #7 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: IMPERIAL TANKS

That could be taken as a full-out flame, but I'm no Moderator, and I'm also inclined to agree...
It's hard to believe that a decade-old vet complains about the tanks of the Guard, and has difficulty understanding a new Codex... not to mention that 10,000 games over ten years averages 2.7 games per day. Please.
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Old 05 Jan 2006, 04:45   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: IMPERIAL TANKS

well that's good, are u a guard player well u could be u should know yourself that they are tank based it is usual just like in the world war on Omaha beach they lost their tanks and came SO close to losing the battle but they had help from Britain it just go's to show that humans are mechanised.
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Old 05 Jan 2006, 05:35   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: IMPERIAL TANKS

As a guard player, I'm inclined to reply with hostility, but as an adult, i am going to try to inform you a bit.

First of all, yes, there ARE Guard players who will rely on their tanks to win battles. There are, however, also Tau players who rely on hammerheads to win battles. There are Marine players who rely on devastators to win battles. There are Dark Eldar players who rely on dark lances to win battles. There are Eldar players who rely on Wraithlords to win battles. There are Necron Players who rely on Nightbringer/Monoliths to win battles.

While the above sounds like I'm saying we should accept what many would view as "cheese", that's not what I'm saying. We would not be doing the guard justice if we didn't recognize that they are in ways designed to be able to rely on tanks, and their tanks are not "cheesy". Guard were designed with tanks in mind, and there is nothing wrong, either fluff or tactics-wise, with a player deciding to make tanks the backbone of his army. If an army like Space Marines, who have very strong assault and troop units, were to have guard-caliber tanks, there would be a balance issue. In turn, if the guard had efficient and hard-hitting assault to compliment their incredible ranged weaponry, the same issue would arise.

Now, this doesn't mean that tank-reliance is the de facto strategy for a successful guard army. In fact, i think you would be much better off facing a half-dozen tanks than 200+ guardsmen (possible with conscripts). Imperial Guard DO NOT need to rely on tanks, they simply have the option to. I personally lean towards infantry-heavy armies, and in my opinion they offer more tactical advantages than tank-heavy armies. You comment on how weak the rest of the army is, yet if you understand anything about 40k at all you know such judgement is irrelevant without taking points cost into account. A big reason why many players max out their tank allotment is simply because buying and painting that many guardsmen is very hard.

Your statements seemed formed more out of frustration than actual logic. Perhaps if you posted your army list, we could offer some advice to help tackle your issues. If you can see how to exploit his/her weaknesses, then your opinion might change. I am hoping this is what you are really looking for, otherwise this is just a thread created to spark an argument. Most everyone here is open-minded to an intelligent debate, and also remember that your [glow=red,2,300]karma[/glow] is everyones first impression of you and you carry it with you.
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Old 05 Jan 2006, 06:57   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: IMPERIAL TANKS

Good your most probely right but it still gets on my nerves that sometimes guard have the opportunity to go over boared with tanks now i dont mined mechanised infantry but I'm not a big fan of lets place ordnance everywhere.


although they do need their tanks to win battles but sometimes people use a ridicules amount 3 or 4 is enough for one army i dont really mind chimares but im not a fan of Russ although they are a well built tank and thanks for correcting me on my previous missunderstanding. I will get the army list to you as soon as i can.
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