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The Golden Rule of 40K.
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Old 22 Aug 2005, 12:05   #1 (permalink)
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Default The Golden Rule of 40K.

I sometimes wonder how many players have ever read the Golden Rule, also known as the Most Important Rule: that both players have a good game.

This topic is about how to ensure this rule is not broken:

1) Army Composition
It is this that causes the most arguments, largely because of Powergamers. Whilst there are many differing views, it is a generally-accepted standpoint that Powergamers violate the Golden Rule. Why? Because they are playing to Win, not to uphold the Golden Rule. Winning at any cost is not fun, especially when the opponent isn't gearing his list to stink of bree.

Thus in order to uphold the Golden Rule, both forces should be balanced. By this, I mean they should both be on the same scale of combat; if both players powergame, fine. Ideally, both players should be aiming for a "balanced" list. Obviously, some armies are naturally better against certain opponents (Harlequins, for example, annihilate any army that relies heavy on characters or monsters to win), but there's nothing we can do about that. Thus, in theory, if both armies are fair, the game is fair, and the Golden Rule is upheld.

2) Scenario
For the love of the God-Emperor, if you want a decent game, play a scenario! For those who aren't sure, Seek and Destroy (also known as "line up and shoot") isn't a "Scenario" in any real sense beyond technically, as it requires near-zero strategic planning to win it with most forces.

Roll your scenario randomly. If you don't like the scenario, deal with it. The best games often involve winning through adversity, and you won't get that chance if you chicken out of everything bar the noob-scenario!

3) Terrain
Firstly, use it.

Secondly, don't overdo it.

Terrain is a difficult balance. Too much gives assault armies an unfair advantage, whilst too little leaves the shooty players free to dominate the game.

4) Narrative
Battles happen for a reason, and it is important you realise this. For example, a battle could be a "line up and shoot" between LaTD and Guard... or it could be the brave men of the Tanith First preparing to hold back and repel the dread Blood Pact on Ouranburg.

Once you've got a narrative, the battle starts to come to life. You can even wrap your armies around the narrative, bringing only the forces that match the scenario, perhaps even ignoring the Force Organisation Chart to do so (eg: bring an entire army of Plague Zombies and nothing else vs Arbites, and have a Resident Evil scenario!).

Narrative is the best way to get an enjoyable fight. I've fought many "fluff-battles" and lost horribly, yet enjoyed it. A prime example was fighting Tanith, where Ibram Gaunt killed over 500 points of my Space Wolves! However, seeing a character I love do so well, even at the expense of my own force, made the game great for me, and countless other moments (such as Major Raine's last stand, the heroic charge of the Tanith First across the highway, daring the guns of the Long Fangs, and the epic duel between the Wolf Lord and Gaunt) meant the game was fantastic to participate in.


So next time you line up your four Basilisks and 9 Obliterators in yet another noobish firefight, stop and check if this game is really going to uphold the Golden Rule, and wonder if there's a better way to play.
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Old 22 Aug 2005, 12:21   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Golden Rule of 40K.

Wargamer, please let me be the first to shake your hand. Amen lad. I've seen a trend toward "Powergamer" lists and I tend to avoid those players and show up at the battlebunker with my Take-all-comers lists. The only thing I don't mention is which army they'll be facing. If a young lad shows up and wants a quick 1000 point game, well then he's going to be facing my balance vanillia ork list thats plenty crunchy and is usually easily beaten by the newcomer or at least he gets to shoot up lots and lots and lots of orks! Should a skumgrod show, well then I'll break out my "Clan" orks list and we'll see how well he does. Or if I'm feeling particularly saucy...I'll let him tailor a list to fight orks, then watch his face crumble as I start plunking down my Tau. Beardy? Perhaps, I just call it Kunnin' Plans! But as Wargamer points out, its about The Golden Rule. Play fair and play nice. If your into the GW hobby only to win battles, your playing the wrong game.
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Old 22 Aug 2005, 12:55   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Golden Rule of 40K.

<Waves a WAAAAAAGHHH banner of doomfulness>


Oh, an Mister Grubdakka. I wishes to talk about stuff with you.....
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Old 22 Aug 2005, 13:10   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Golden Rule of 40K.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grubdakka
... The only thing I don't mention is which army they'll be facing. ... I'll let him tailor a list to fight orks, then watch his face crumble as I start plunking down my Tau.
According to the rules in the book, this behavior is called Cheating. According to the rules in the book, your opponent is allowed to know which army you will be using before they make their list. If you deliberately mislead opponents as to which army they will be facing, that is just as much breaking the rules in the book as moving your guys too far or lying about what the dice rolled.

You don't have to tell your opponent the composition of your force in advance. You do have to tell them which army you are playing.
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Old 22 Aug 2005, 13:11   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Golden Rule of 40K.

Unless they are beardy :P
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Old 22 Aug 2005, 13:12   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Golden Rule of 40K.

Quote:
Originally Posted by redbeard
You don't have to tell your opponent the composition of your force in advance.* You do have to tell them which army you are playing.
A rule that should be ignored. It essentially says "Oh, I won't let you 100% gear against me, just 95% gear...".

People who uphold that rule are powergamers. I never ask my opponent his army prior to writing my own.
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Old 22 Aug 2005, 15:33   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Golden Rule of 40K.

People who uphold that rule are not necessarily powergamers. You're making sweeping generalizations.

Pretend you're the real general. Are you going to deploy the same force against a tyranid horde that you would against an armoured company?

Dogged refusal to adhere to the rules in the book leads to, in my opinion, the exact sort of problem you're seeking to avoid. What's rule number one? "that both players have a good game" Talking to your opponent prior to the game, about what army you're playing, what they're playing, and what sort of game you expect is a good way to make sure you both have enjoyable games. Communication is key. That's why that rule is in the book.

You're only looking at this from the perspective that your opponent can gear up against you. But, you get to do the same thing, so that isn't much of an advantage. And, it prevents problems that arrise when people play armies that are at the extremes.

How am I going to have an enjoyable game when I bring my generic marine army, only to find that a huge number of my points are completely useless against an armoured company? Would a real marine commander send his men in against a bunch of tanks equipped with heavy bolters and flamers?

How am I suposed to have a good game if I'm playing footslogging orks, and I find that my opponent is playing a mechanized Tau force, and never has a single infantry model deployed outside their devilfish? I mean, that's one of the most discussed lists on this forum. It has more in common with armoured company than anything else. Either your opponent overloaded on anti-tank weapons, or they don't have a chance. Is that fun for both players?

Yeah, someone might bring loads of heavy bolters against me. But I don't get stuck having no answer for their stuff either.
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Old 22 Aug 2005, 15:40   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Golden Rule of 40K.

Hurray! Wargamer, if there was a smilie that did a bow I would use it here. Lately I've deliberately tried to limit my gaming against most of my local group as most seem to have an absolutely HORRIBLE attitude toward the game. All sorts of gouda-encrusted crap is used and rules are horribly exploited to the point where one guy will claim a cover save if an indirect fire shot passes OVER a forest on the way to his troops. I have even begun the construction of my own gaming table so I can prevent all that crap by simply saying "my house, my rules"
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Old 22 Aug 2005, 15:46   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Golden Rule of 40K.

Well done WG, I had a game a few days ago at 500pts for the battle of inskar in GW glasgow, It was no fun, 3 zoanthropes, hive tryrant and 30 spineguants, no fun, I played fluff based marines, drop podding into the middle of the hoard, abliet to be decimated, however My land spedder put the wind up his -------.

I always play fluff, My sisters for example, pure, no arcos, no bombardment, no inquisitors, no allies, no strom troopers no assasins, none of them, weak maybe, but so what.
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Old 22 Aug 2005, 16:52   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: The Golden Rule of 40K.

Quote:
Originally Posted by redbeard
People who uphold that rule are not necessarily powergamers.* You're making sweeping generalizations.*
.
building a specific list against a specific army is a hallmark or powergaming. its a facet of it, but not the whole story, obviously.

Quote:
Originally Posted by redbeard
People who uphold that rule are not necessarily powergamers.* You're making sweeping generalizations.*

Pretend you're the real general.* Are you going to deploy the same force against a tyranid horde that you would against an armoured company?*
but you are not a "real" general. you are not facing tyranids. you are playing a game. unless its a "bring it on" game, your list should be tournament style, and perfectly capable of completing any mission type, or facing any opponent. the only changes you shoud make should be you tweaking your list, trying new units, new tactics etc. playing this way makes you a far better player.

Quote:
Originally Posted by redbeard
Dogged refusal to adhere to the rules in the book leads to, in my opinion, the exact sort of problem you're seeking to avoid.* What's rule number one?* "that both players have a good game"* Talking to your opponent prior to the game, about what army you're playing, what they're playing, and what sort of game you expect is a good way to make sure you both have enjoyable games.* Communication is key.* That's why that rule is in the book.*
communication is good. but building lists specifically tailored to defeat a specific army in a specific mission isnt. hopefully, you ropponent should have the same mentality as you.
"i play tau"
"i play orks"
"fancy* agame"
"sure"
"standard, tourney lists?"
"excellent. random mission?"
"genius"

Quote:
Originally Posted by redbeard
You're only looking at this from the perspective that your opponent can gear up against you.* But, you get to do the same thing, so that isn't much of an advantage.* And, it prevents problems that arrise when people play armies that are at the extremes.
but wargamer never does that, by his own statements. neither do i gear my lists. and i damn well expect the same attitude from my opponents. its simp,y not fun otherwise.

Quote:
Originally Posted by redbeard
How am I going to have an enjoyable game when I bring my generic marine army, only to find that a huge number of my points are completely useless against an armoured company?* Would a real marine commander send his men in against a bunch of tanks equipped with heavy bolters and flamers?
armoured companies tend to be rare. and those marines could have dropped in to kill a commander, only to find a damned armoured company rolling into town, if you want a fluffy explanation.
it should be a challenging game to you. you cant line up and charge. you must use your head, your mobility, crack the tank side/rear armour. really, if you are a good general, your list should be just as capable of taking on an armoured company, as an ork horde.

Quote:
Originally Posted by redbeard
How am I suposed to have a good game if I'm playing footslogging orks, and I find that my opponent is playing a mechanized Tau force, and never has a single infantry model deployed outside their devilfish?* *I mean, that's one of the most discussed lists on this forum.* It has more in common with armoured company than anything else.* Either your opponent overloaded on anti-tank weapons, or they don't have a chance.* Is that fun for both players?
erm, you take rokkits, and lots of them. you smack things with nob powerfists. you take a looted leman russ. to play to complete the mission, not a n00bish attempt to kill all ov da spoon'eads. figure it out. a balanced ork footslogging list should have aces up its sleeve to take on a mechtau force. just as the mechtau force should have the aces to take on the horde.



Quote:
Originally Posted by redbeard
Yeah, someone might bring loads of heavy bolters against me.* But I don't get stuck having no answer for their stuff either.
again, this is striking me as powergaming, if he tailored his list to have lots of h.bolters in it. if not, its just tough, and its his standard list. you should have the brains to figure out ways to avoid it. lots of heavy bolters = limited anti tank ability. roll with that. use cover to avoid his firepower. etcetera.

wargamer, consider an edit to your post, and think about the random mission generator. it is really good, and does add a lot of stuff the rulebook missions lack.
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