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Banshees meet the Lash Whip
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Old 29 Mar 2010, 15:27   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Banshees meet the Lash Whip

Banshess one way or another end up toe to toe with Tyranid warriors armed with lash whips and bone swords. Banshee masks let you go @ I 10, Lash whips reduce initiative to 1. Which rule takes precedence!? Locally, we have agreed that they simply cancel each other out, and we revert to initiative order, but that seems unlikely.

I can't even use my bias towards a certain army, as I have both Eldar and Tyranids.
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Old 29 Mar 2010, 16:10   #2 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Banshees meet the Lash Whip

Based on what you said. banshees gain the ability to go at initiative 10, however the lash whips lower it to 1, 10 ---> 1 is my call just by raw here. I would have to read both codex's word for word to figure this one out.
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Old 29 Mar 2010, 16:15   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Banshees meet the Lash Whip

I think what you guys did is the best option, because it probably doesn't say antything about the order in which you do the abilities. Cancelling out seems like the best bet, or maybe you guys could roll off every round?
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Old 29 Mar 2010, 16:17   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Banshees meet the Lash Whip

Alternatively, initiative 1 become 10 right? IIRC, banshees say when assault begins, I goes to 10, Lash whips say, any model in base contact has its I reduced to 1. I am tempted to say, Banshees initiative goes to 10 when assault starts, and then is reduced to 1 immediately when they go into base contact? Hehe, quantum paradox are they in assault when in base contact or base contact when in assault?
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Old 29 Mar 2010, 16:19   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Banshees meet the Lash Whip

While moving, models are "assaulting." Once in base to base, they are "engaged."

I'm not familiar enough with the codex to say anything else. :P
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Old 29 Mar 2010, 17:00   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Banshees meet the Lash Whip

Heh, guess its time to hire a crack team of lawyers and go through this line by line as it were. With the amount of time we tried reasoning it, I am glad there is no clear consensus to make us feel like fools.
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Old 29 Mar 2010, 17:04   #7 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: Banshees meet the Lash Whip

It sounds like this is how it would work, any banshees that assault and are not in BtB contact with a model with a lash whip would strike at I10, but any in BtB contact would strike at I1.

I don't have a copy of the Eldar codex, but if Sau1us is correct and the text reads 'when assault begins' that would only apply to when they first charge in, but the lash whip says any model in BtB contact. So if a model is in BtB contact it is a I1, if not, then it would be I10.
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Old 29 Mar 2010, 17:13   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Banshees meet the Lash Whip

One could say that 'on average' our rendition was correct heh.
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Old 29 Mar 2010, 19:23   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Banshees meet the Lash Whip

Probably best to either roll off or have the two cancel out and conduct the combat at normal I. Seems like the most logical solution.
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Old 29 Mar 2010, 20:16   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Banshees meet the Lash Whip

It depends on the exact wording.

If the Mask says "allows to strike at I10", then it still strikes at I10, because while the initiative is not changed, only the order.

It's very similiar to how powerfists work. As an example, say a model with a power fist had the Furious Charge special rule. On a charge, it still strikes at I1,despite being I5, because the power fist has no affect on the model's initiative, but has it's own rule for when its attacks occur.
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