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Conflicting Rules
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Old 19 Mar 2010, 19:05   #1 (permalink)
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Default Conflicting Rules

Hey guys, an interesting conversation came up when some frineds and I were talking, specifically including the ways different rules effecting Leadership Values work with each other.
Now, the Orkz have a Mob Rule, which allows them to substitute the number of models in the squad for their leadership. Now, the Necrons Pariahs have a rule that makes everyone within a certain radius count as Ld7. If a group of, say, 20 Orkz were to be within this radius, would they count as Ld20, therefore Fearless, or LD7, as per the Pariahs?

So as not to have a useless thread, feel free to post any other conflicting and or confusing, similar, rules questions
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Old 19 Mar 2010, 19:12   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Conflicting Rules

The take on this in the Adepticon FAQ depended on the "duration" of the modifier. For example, if Pariahs just say "all units within x" have leadership 7, then at any point the mob rule check is used, it would immediately be overwritten by the ongoing leadership 7 modifier.
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Old 19 Mar 2010, 21:01   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Conflicting Rules

Mob Rule says they may substitute the size of their mob for their normal leadership, and in a squad of 11 or more they are Fearless. The Soulless rule states that enemy models in range count as Ld 7. I find the phrasing "counts as" interesting, to me that suggests that it doesn't matter what the units actual leadership as, the Soulless ability causes them to be treated as Ld 7. So Mob Rule makes them Fearless and Ld 10, which the Soulless rule then reduces to 7, making our intrepid stupid greenskins Fearless and Ld 7.
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Old 19 Mar 2010, 21:02   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Conflicting Rules

Ah, but IIRC, the ork rule there actually states that units of 11 or more are treated as fearless, which would render the point moot except for where there's 8-10 orks. At which point, I'd stick with the ld7 option.

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Old 19 Mar 2010, 21:13   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Conflicting Rules

Pariah doesn't change the mob rule though, it only changes the models LD stat. The ork model has Ld7 normally anyway doesn't it?
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Old 19 Mar 2010, 21:35   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Conflicting Rules

Leadership on the Nobz is one point higher, I belive.
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Old 19 Mar 2010, 21:37   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Conflicting Rules

I would rule that both rules interact perfectly fine.

You can only substitute your "natural" LD once, otherwise it's not your normal one. The Pariah forces whatever he current LD to be 7 if the units in range. I don't see them as conflicting, one being an activated effect and the other a constant.

However, the Fearless granted by the Mob rule would be a constant effect. So I'd play them as LD 7 Fearless Orks.

This means that things like the Deciever could still potential pin them or psychic stuff may go awry, but for other effects they are still fearless as long as they had 11 or more models at the time.
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Old 19 Mar 2010, 21:42   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Conflicting Rules

Roll off.

There are just too many ways this can be interpreted.
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For my part, I believe that the Pariahs win this scenario. Way I see it; Orks in mobz 8,9,10,11+ have their leadership as constantly X. Pariahs show up and temporarily nuke that bonus. When the Pariahs aren't influencing them anymore, the ldrshp goes back to whatever the # of boyz is.
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Old 19 Mar 2010, 21:48   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Conflicting Rules

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Originally Posted by HijiriOni
Pariah doesn't change the mob rule though, it only changes the models LD stat.
All Mob Rule does is substitute mob size for the unit's normal leadership value. It doesn't say their leadership can't be modified by outside factors, or that they only ever test using the mob size. Mob Rule substitutes for their normal Ld7, and then Soulless makes them count as Ld7.
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Old 19 Mar 2010, 22:10   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Conflicting Rules

Mob rule's "fearless at 11+" works on number of orks, not leadership. So mob rule does more than just substitution.

Therefore, by the logic available to me, enderwiggin is correct with the Ld7 fearless orks.
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