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Question about my upcoming Tournament rules
View Poll Results: Do the following tournament rules (see first post) confer an unfair advantage to certain armies?
Yes 12 100.00%
No 0 0%
Voters: 12. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 24 Oct 2008, 20:41   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
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Default Question about my upcoming Tournament rules

Quote:
Army List rules and requirements
500 points
1+troop Choice
no 3 wound models
no vehicles with total Armour value higher then 33

1000 points(must include original 500 point list)
1 Hq
2 Troops
no 4 wound models
no vehicles with Armour 14 on more then 1 side
My local Game shop is going to run a tournament with these rules. It's going to be 4 games at the 500pts against different opponents (which I have no problem with the restrictions at that point level). And then the overall winners will face off in a last game at 1,000pts.

It's the 1,000pt restriction I have a problem with. I'm banned from using Hive Tyrants or a Carnifex, but my opponents are free to use Dreadnaughts, Predators, Terminator Squads, Wraithlords (an MC usuable under these conditions)...

I'm mean sure, Land Raiders are out, as are Avatars or Greater Demons, and Monoliths (personally I think Necrons are getting screwed here too - their options are limited enough to begin with)... but the sheer amount of what is still left in just leaves me scratching my head when I compare it to what I'm being banned from using.

The Carnifex, Dreadnought, and Wraithlord are all similar in points, all similar in survivability by the percentages, all similar in CC or at range with the right upgrades... yet those are fine, but the Carnifex is not.

Am I out of my mind thinking this harms me more as a Tyranid player than a lot of other armies, or am I just crazy?

I really would like to see rational arguments that it helps provide balance for a 1,000pt game and that it doesn't unduly hamper my army, compare to a lot of others. I'm feeling kind of bummed about it right now, but I want it to make sense to me that these rules need to be in place. Can anybody provide me with some extra perspective?
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Old 24 Oct 2008, 20:49   #2 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
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Default Re: Question about my upcoming Tournament rules

The one thing that I would say is...

No restrictions other than no special characters.

Implement a Sportsmanship system.

Its a thing that seems to work great here, you have to use the basic FOC, but beyond that, no change.

Its the sportsmanship system that gets them, because if you get a low sportsmanship score you cannot win the tourney regaurdless.
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Old 24 Oct 2008, 21:38   #3 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Question about my upcoming Tournament rules

At 1000 points you should not have ANY restrictions other than what are in the codex.

At 500 points...

Well you really SHOULD NOT be playing a tournament at 500 points, but if you are the combat patrol rules are good to use. Basically what they've got there.

But the shop owner/even organizer is clearly inexperienced with 40k and has implemented unfair restrictions to counter their own fears. I assure you these are calculated based on personal bias/fear and to give an advantage to the organizer, even if he did it subconsciously.
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Old 24 Oct 2008, 21:59   #4 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Question about my upcoming Tournament rules

Quote:
Originally Posted by Falstead
At 1000 points you should not have ANY restrictions other than what are in the codex.
I definantly agree, necrons would be a little skrewed as are tiranids and tau.
Necron: No monolith, too bad I'll just take 4 more distroyers >
Tyranids: Nezalhualixtlan already made a point, no carnifexes, or hive tyrants, ouch
Tau: Tau cannot take shas'O's
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Old 24 Oct 2008, 23:21   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Question about my upcoming Tournament rules

Adapt. It's what Nids do. Take a load of Warriors and a couple Zoanthropes to open up tanks, then just load out on Gaunts and win on sheer numbers. If you don't play for Kill Points you're fine.

Do I think it's a fair tournament? No. However, I strongly feel that anyone can still walk away with the prize at that tourney even if they're playing as restricted as you are.

I have to disagree with Bad Moon as well. I feel that Sportsmanship scoring is really a terrible idea in all cases, because at least one player is going to walk away feeling as though he was denied a win. That leads to taking a plunge in sports score. Also, a cheesy list is different by person. I feel fine playing against any list, regardless. I don't scream cheese just because I run up against a well-thought-out army list. However, a lot of people I know don't think that way and so when I built up a nasty army list, I'd get hammered in Sports score when I feel I've taken a well-balanced list.

That's why I don't play comp tourneys ;D
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Old 24 Oct 2008, 23:27   #6 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Question about my upcoming Tournament rules

eldar get pretty hosed in the 500 pt rules listed, because they don't allow for the "less than complete squads" rules that are in the 40k in 40 min games, but seem to have the 40k in 40 min restrictions. No farseer = bad news for an eldar player.

So while you might be at a disadvantage in the 1000 pt game, Tyranids thrive in the 500 pt games. I actually think those are neat rules to balance out the imperfections of the combat patrol issues.
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Old 25 Oct 2008, 00:13   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Question about my upcoming Tournament rules

Well, the Store manager that's running the tournament is a friend of mine, and I've been trying to get him to rescind the restrictions. He's actually got a lot of experience playing 40k, he's been playing the game since 2nd edition I believe, I just happen to think he hasn't fully thought through the ramifactions of those restrictions.

And, I'm quite limited in my options. I can't take a load of Warriors. I own 4. I can't take tons of Gaunts and Hormagaunts in a real swarm... I own enough to field a decent number for a balanced list, but not enough to run a true swarm. I've got 3 Zoanthropes, which I'll absolutely have to take to crack the heavier stuff. And I own a Flying Tyrant and 2 Carnifex models, 1 CC, 1 Sniperfex. I've got a Lictor, Broodlor, and 3 Raverners. The one thing I own a ton of are Genestealers.

But my problem is this, when you restrict the game like this, the other armies particularly Space Marines which I'll probably face a lot of - will be filling out their units with stuff that's pretty much really good at killing what I can take. Like filling out a lot of Heavy Bolters, Assault Cannons, rather than having to worry about taking some Lascannons and maybe a few Powerfists. So essentially, not only does it unduly hamper my tactical flexibility, it makes my opponents just that much more efficient at killing the stuff I can take.

I just don't see why the game needs to be restricted at 1,000 points.
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Old 25 Oct 2008, 00:37   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Question about my upcoming Tournament rules

Quote:
Originally Posted by emmagine
eldar get pretty hosed in the 500 pt rules listed, because they don't allow for the "less than complete squads" rules that are in the 40k in 40 min games, but seem to have the 40k in 40 min restrictions. No farseer = bad news for an eldar player.

So while you might be at a disadvantage in the 1000 pt game, Tyranids thrive in the 500 pt games. I actually think those are neat rules to balance out the imperfections of the combat patrol issues.
I guess that's true, some armies are certainly worse at the 500 point level. I don't know how many opponents I'll see Eldar though, the only friend I have that plays (and he's the only Eldar player I know that comes to the store) also has enough Dark Angels to field a 500 & 1,000 point list now.

I don't know I guess well see how it goes.
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Old 25 Oct 2008, 08:05   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Question about my upcoming Tournament rules

Eldar can't have a HQ...

Tyranids just have the broodlord...

Ouch...
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