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Watching a Phil Kelly-Matt Hutson batrep is like---
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Old 04 Sep 2008, 01:43   #1 (permalink)
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Default Watching a Phil Kelly-Matt Hutson batrep is like---

---watching a green beret club a paraplegic baby seal to death.


I miss a few battle reports here and there, but why do these two keep getting matched up? Every game between them that's not an army's inaugral battle report is a foregone conclusion. Unless it's an army's new release, I've never seen an occasion where Phil Kelly lost in a straight competitive environment and I've never seen an occasion where Matt Hutson in an none inaugral battle report won through tactical finesses.


I mean I understand Phil is supposed to be the xenos player in that studio and Matt is the spacemarines guy...but seriously.


Also what's with codex authors not even understanding how their armies work? Andy Hoare honestly has no idea how the Tau are supposed to play based on his batreps, Matt Hutson doesn't know the first thing about tactical flexibility which should be the marine's strongpoint, and Gav Thorpe just cannot play period.
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Old 04 Sep 2008, 02:03   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Watching a Phil Kelly-Matt Hutson batrep is like---

That's because Andy Chambers did most of the work on the Tau codex from what I've heard...




GW battle reports look nothing like real games when tactics (most) or army composition are brought to a tournament level.
They do try to turn a profit in most things they do.
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Old 04 Sep 2008, 02:51   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Watching a Phil Kelly-Matt Hutson batrep is like---

Honestly, if I got hired on there, I'd look at my opponent and ask "Can we just not play and say we did?" Write up the whole thing the way they want it(Battles accompanying a new army never result in a newcomer loss, blah, blah the usual), inserting lots of fanboyish fluff references, and the obligatory lucky dice rolls making "the unit nobody thought would do well" the top performer, then go on to play a real game.

Seriously, they do stupid stuff. Like in the last batrep, I can't help but point out the ork player as ridiculously stupid, doing stuff like having the deathkoptas hanging around in the back of the army doing nothing. I'd table them without paying attention.

It's not as if you can't have a good battle report with fluff for a game in which both players are competitive.
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Old 04 Sep 2008, 03:00   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Watching a Phil Kelly-Matt Hutson batrep is like---

No, but it is more difficult in tourney and WD settings.

I do wonder if GW forces certain army selections onto the people playing...
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Old 04 Sep 2008, 03:12   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Watching a Phil Kelly-Matt Hutson batrep is like---

Quote:
I do wonder if GW forces certain army selections onto the people playing...
They did this time, rather blatantly. The two forces had to use all the models from AOBR, though they didn't have to be in the same squad.

TO Crazed, I figured I knew who won the report once I summed it up as "Phil Kelly vs. somebody I've never heard of before". He even made good use of that ten man squad of grots that shows up all the time in battle reports.
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Old 04 Sep 2008, 04:13   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Watching a Phil Kelly-Matt Hutson batrep is like---

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slave to the Bell.
No, but it is more difficult in tourney and WD settings.

I do wonder if GW forces certain army selections onto the people playing...
I would say typically, yes. Lists I see in normal and tournament play often use less variety(official batreps almost never use more than two of the same unit loadout). Additionally, recently released models for armies always seem to be in the batreps. Also, lists tend to stick relatively close to the theme of the army. Ie, orks? Charge in and chop em up, mainly.

In regular play, I routinely see less balanced, and often much less fluffy armies. Of course, triple halo-falcon lists probably make for very boring batreps.
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Old 04 Sep 2008, 05:53   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Watching a Phil Kelly-Matt Hutson batrep is like---

There are times like these when I have to sit down and just have a pint of ale to forget the visions on what I have seen of late.

This batrep is a two pinter for me
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Old 04 Sep 2008, 05:55   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Watching a Phil Kelly-Matt Hutson batrep is like---

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyndmyr
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slave to the Bell.
No, but it is more difficult in tourney and WD settings.

I do wonder if GW forces certain army selections onto the people playing...
I would say typically, yes. Lists I see in normal and tournament play often use less variety(official batreps almost never use more than two of the same unit loadout). Additionally, recently released models for armies always seem to be in the batreps. Also, lists tend to stick relatively close to the theme of the army. Ie, orks? Charge in and chop em up, mainly.

In regular play, I routinely see less balanced, and often much less fluffy armies. Of course, triple halo-falcon lists probably make for very boring batreps.

To address this issue, mostly they have to use studio armies painted by the 'eavy metal team, which are based on which new models there are, which ones look cool. They're often varied and more to show off the models. That's why they're very un-tourney like and not competitive at all. So you'll see very illogical choices. One case off the top of my head was the 3rd. ed. batrep between Andy Chamber's space wolves and Jervis Johnson's orks. That ork list couldn't have been any worse if they tried. But it was all the studio had. (8 stormboyz mob? two dreadnaughts with like...burnas and scorchas? one rokkit launcha in the ENTIRE ARMY against the spacewolves who had a Landraider and a Leman Russ Exterminator?)


It's true though, Andy Chambers understood how Tau worked, but he left and Andy Hoare had to take over something he had no passion in nor did he really understand.

And in defence of the players, White Dwarf battle reports take place in environments where tactics don't flow that easily. Since each turn takes about 2 hours. I'd gather it'd be difficult to keep your mind on coherent tactics, especially when often it's not your army of choice or even an army you know.

I don't think battle reports are staged in the way we think they are, because inaugral armies do lose and draw occasionally. It doesn't happen often, because usually the inaugral army has a few tricks up their sleeves and they also get the author of the codex to use the army, but it does happen. For example look to Necron's inaugral battle report against Dark Angels which was a loss, Daemons vs. Spacemarines which I think was a draw, the first game of the new Bretonnians against Orcs which was a loss.



And lastly, when you have a custom army vs. a studio army it's an exercise in hilarity. Since as I said before, the studio armies are not competitive at all, and the custom armies of the players are almost tournament standard.

For example just off the top of my head, this was Phil Kelly's third ed. eldar list from his private collection (which he used against Graham Davey's no less dangerous Black Legion before the EoT campaign):

Eldrad
Seer Council
2 squads of black guardians with bright lance and starcannon
1 squad of guardians with starcannon
1 squad of storm guardians with flamers

large squad of howling banshees with exarch, executioner and acrobatic
wave serpent with spirit stones

fire dragons with no exarch

wraithlord with starcannon and twin flamers

three war walkers with starcannons and brightlance



That's basically an incredibly competitive list for 3rd. ed. Other examples include Owen Ree's Dark Angel which is just an exercise in las/plas powergaming (this was the dark angels army that defeated the Necrons in the Necron inaugral batrep), and Phil Kelly's 4th ed. nids where every second unit was either rending or a monstrous creature, and the first unit was always a terrifying large brood of str 4 hormagaunts.
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Old 04 Sep 2008, 16:30   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Watching a Phil Kelly-Matt Hutson batrep is like---

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazedmongoose
And lastly, when you have a custom army vs. a studio army it's an exercise in hilarity. Since as I said before, the studio armies are not competitive at all, and the custom armies of the players are almost tournament standard.

For example just off the top of my head, this was Phil Kelly's third ed. eldar list from his private collection (which he used against Graham Davey's no less dangerous Black Legion before the EoT campaign):

Eldrad
Seer Council
2 squads of black guardians with bright lance and starcannon
1 squad of guardians with starcannon
1 squad of storm guardians with flamers

large squad of howling banshees with exarch, executioner and acrobatic
wave serpent with spirit stones

fire dragons with no exarch

wraithlord with starcannon and twin flamers

three war walkers with starcannons and brightlance



That's basically an incredibly competitive list for 3rd. ed. Other examples include Owen Ree's Dark Angel which is just an exercise in las/plas powergaming (this was the dark angels army that defeated the Necrons in the Necron inaugral batrep), and Phil Kelly's 4th ed. nids where every second unit was either rending or a monstrous creature, and the first unit was always a terrifying large brood of str 4 hormagaunts.
Ahh yes... Owen Rees' Plasma Angels. It's funny how they stopped appearing in battle reports when 4th came out. I like to think that he tried to use them, but overheated himself into oblivion
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Old 04 Sep 2008, 19:06   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Watching a Phil Kelly-Matt Hutson batrep is like---

It does really annoy me.
Does anyone remember the battle report between orks and space marine when orks came out.
Why the hell did he pick 3 rhinos!!!
He was outgunned by orks!!!
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