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Gamer's courtesy...a little advice from an old gamer
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Old 03 Aug 2008, 01:24   #1 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Gamer's courtesy...a little advice from an old gamer

Well, today was my first experience gaming at the store in my new town. I was really psyched about this and spent all week finishing up conversion projects, my Obliterator and my Land Raider so I could field 2k of Chaos (my Eldar are in the process of a 325 point makeover).

I got to the shop to find all of the veteran gamers enbroiled in an 8,000 point Apocalypse battle (which was all of turn 1) and realized that it would be a while before I got to play.

This kid, Greg, offered to play - his Blood Angels against my Chaos. Fair enough. He grabs a list (which I'm pretty sure was over 2k) with wargear that changed during the game and, in one case, was just plain illegal. What is more...he was using the old Blood Angels rules!

Nevertheless, I played the game, coaching him through 5th edition, enduring his combined move / run turns (i.e. roll a dice and move 6"+D6" in one phase) and correcting his various rules problems.

Once this game was finished (a draw), we set up for another game, Greg and I vs Orks & Tau. The Ork player had sat through the previous game and would let out a chortle or snicker every time the words "ram" or "penetrate" were used and the Tau player brought some surprisingly well painted models and some completely unassembled models to the table (keep in mind that I stayed up to 1AM the night before making sure everything in my army was complete).

Needless to say, I ended up as a rules official for most of the game. The Tau player didn't even know what his wargear did or how to find his units stats ("what do my Fire Warriors need to hit?"). I'm convinced that none of them have even opened the 5th edition book...*sigh*.

But we made it through several turns before I bowed out. My terminators and Typhus were on the objective, my Plague Marines were strong on my right flank near the objective and their armies had been shooting for 3 turns with only 3 casualties. So it was going to be over in two bloody turns.

When the game was over, I offered some advice to the players. To Greg - get online and download the damn codex...I mean it's FREE. To the Tau player - read your freaking codex. And to the Ork player - a pile of tactical stuff which probably ended up getting filtered through his head to sound like the script of Love Guru.

[hr]

I say all of that to offer this advice to my fellow gamers:

If you're a new gamer, please, please, please, learn the rules. Above all else, learn the rules. They're not that hard to learn. If you need to make cheat sheets, do it. The reference sheets are spectacular. Use them. If you don't at least know the rules for your army, don't play.

If you're a veteran gamer, please, make every attempt to welcome and include the new gamers and visitors to your shop. Cliques are nice because you really get to know people, but the game is a very social activity...talk to spectators between turns, introduce yourself, and try to engage them about the hobby.

Sorry about the long-winded lecture, but I ended up spending 4 hours running games today for teenagers, when I really wanted to spend 4 hours playing a game.
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Old 03 Aug 2008, 01:36   #2 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
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Default Re: Gamer's courtesy...a little advice from an old gamer

Sounds frustrating! Kudos for fighting the good fight though.
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Old 03 Aug 2008, 02:31   #3 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Gamer's courtesy...a little advice from an old gamer

1st ow my head would hurt after that experiance and 2) what's wrong with runing when moving it speeds things up and im pretty sure you don't even have to do it in your shooting phase,

quote from head: A unit may run insted of shooting, yada yada. So on that it dosent actully say "in the shooting phase"

Could be wrong mind you



That could be considerd bad but only today i witnessed a noob using a stand in model for a falcon

5 euro for the person who guess's what he used for the stand-in

nope it wasn't a coke can, or a rhino
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you's give up.
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yep it was a eldar guardian ???
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Metal fans are allowed to use stereotyped generalisations of other types of music. Why? Because the "avatar" of Rap and similar music is a binged up black guy who holds his gun in such a way as he will probably shoot his own foot off in a gunfight. The avatar of Metal is a bearded, unwashed Scandinavian guy who kills you, your family, your town, your country and the neighbouring country because there isn't much else to do up in the snowy fjords of Vikingland.
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Old 03 Aug 2008, 02:39   #4 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Gamer's courtesy...a little advice from an old gamer

Quote:
Originally Posted by D Black
1st ow my head would hurt after that experiance and 2) what's wrong with runing when moving it speeds things up and im pretty sure you don't even have to do it in your shooting phase,

quote from head: A unit may run insted of shooting, yada yada. So on that it dosent actully say "in the shooting phase"

Could be wrong mind you
A) The rule is found in the Shooting Phase section of the rules. B) The rule says "instead of firing" and since all firing is done in the shooting phase...well, I hope you can take it from there.

So here are the problems with Running & moving at the same time:

1) You know exactly how far your Run will take you. So you lose the chance of being caught flat footed on a "1". If you know that you are going to move 12" or 7" it can change which direction or which route you take.

2) It can effect your shooting phase. If you have a unit you want out of the way and you run on a "1" suddenly your target can claim a cover save. Again, you simply get them out of the way if you do both in the movement phase.

3) When "running" with Jump Infantry you can combine moves to miss dangerous / difficult terrain altogether. Is that ruin 12" away? No worries, you move 13-18" and miss it completely!

So, yes, it does make a difference. And, yes, you do have to do it in the Shooting Phase.
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Old 03 Aug 2008, 04:21   #5 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: Gamer's courtesy...a little advice from an old gamer

but instead of firing dosent nessesarly mean in the shooting phase

for example i could word heavy weapons as this
i want to fire my H. bolter instead of moving

just saying it's kinda worded bad and is open to interpretation
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Quote from: Wargamer

Metal fans are allowed to use stereotyped generalisations of other types of music. Why? Because the "avatar" of Rap and similar music is a binged up black guy who holds his gun in such a way as he will probably shoot his own foot off in a gunfight. The avatar of Metal is a bearded, unwashed Scandinavian guy who kills you, your family, your town, your country and the neighbouring country because there isn't much else to do up in the snowy fjords of Vikingland.
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Old 03 Aug 2008, 11:01   #6 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
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Default Re: Gamer's courtesy...a little advice from an old gamer

Hmm I see your point D Black but I think that's taking RAW a bit too far, we all know GW has a habit of leaving some areas a bit grey. As far as I'm concerned, the RAI are that you run in the shooting phase.
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Old 03 Aug 2008, 11:19   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Gamer's courtesy...a little advice from an old gamer

Quote:
Originally Posted by D Black (away till the 10th)
but instead of firing dosent nessesarly mean in the shooting phase
When does firing normally take place? :P

Anyway, like Rezzy I can see why you would think that, but the fact that this rule appears in the Shooting Phase section of the book leads me to believe that you run in the shooting phase. And like Emlyn pointed out, it'd be pretty messed up otherwise.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redbeard
Knowing the rules is not WAAC. Bringing tough lists is not WAAC. Acting within the scope of the rules is not WAAC.
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Old 03 Aug 2008, 12:10   #8 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Gamer's courtesy...a little advice from an old gamer

Okay, sorry but this is really ridiculous...but exactly what I encountered during my game. Here's an idea - read your rulebook!

I quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRB p.16 inset, line 2
In their Shooting Phase, units may choose to run instead of firing...
It is NOT a RAW problem it is an oversight on the part of the reader.
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Old 03 Aug 2008, 12:14   #9 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Gamer's courtesy...a little advice from an old gamer

Quote:
Originally Posted by Farseer_Emlyn
Okay, sorry but this is really ridiculous...but exactly what I encountered during my game. Here's an idea - read your rulebook!

I quote

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRB p.16 inset, line 2
In their Shooting Phase, units may choose to run instead of firing...
It is NOT a RAW problem it is an oversight on the part of the reader.
Yeah, I had to check my rulebook just to make sure...it does indeed say, in plain English, "In their Shooting Phase"...

How the hell could you possibly interpret that any differently D Black? :P
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redbeard
Knowing the rules is not WAAC. Bringing tough lists is not WAAC. Acting within the scope of the rules is not WAAC.
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Old 03 Aug 2008, 12:51   #10 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
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Default Re: Gamer's courtesy...a little advice from an old gamer

Well I hope I can be forgiven for not knowing that as I have not looked at the 5th Ed rulebook once and haven't touched the 4th Ed one for about a year. :P
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