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Will 5th Ed fix the REAL problem with 40k
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Old 31 May 2008, 04:22   #1 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Will 5th Ed fix the REAL problem with 40k

Forgive me if I missed this in 70 pages of 5th Ed discussion.

I have been playing 40k off and on since the 1st Ed.

I think the real problem with 40k is finding a balance between realism and pacing.

I know a lot of gamers who just have no interest in playing games that take 3-4 hours. On the other hand I know several older players who left the game after 2nd Ed and have never returned, they felt the game was dumbed-down.

3rd and 4th edition attempted to speed up the game play which was a welcome improvement for some.

I am afraid that 5th edition (bringing back old rules) will return the game to a static prolong stand-offs. Will this bring back the guys who left with 2nd Ed? Or will it turn off many of the newcomers?



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Old 31 May 2008, 04:30   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Will 5th Ed fix the REAL problem with 40k

Well, I like 4th edition cause it's fast and because I this is what I learned. :P
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Old 31 May 2008, 04:31   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Will 5th Ed fix the REAL problem with 40k

Well, I've seen some guys on Warseer announce that they've come back after so many years away from the hobby (and indeed one guy used to play 2nd it seems), but as far as "dumbing down" goes, this has been a constant complaint with all the new codexes since Eldar I think, and doesn't seem to have been "fixed" with 5th.

I don't know if it'll be any faster.
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Old 31 May 2008, 05:53   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Will 5th Ed fix the REAL problem with 40k

Fifth, overall, is slightly faster, IMO.

Of course, this probably wont be noticable at first, since we'll all be adjusting to the rules.
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Old 31 May 2008, 07:43   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Will 5th Ed fix the REAL problem with 40k

5ED is faster. But unfortunately I believe it is tailored to a younger audience. The Dumbing Down Aspect is not just coming down from WarSeer but from other web sites as well.

IF GW would have left the concept of being able to customize your army with wargear and traits, there will be less grumbling from the vets with 5ED.

I know why they did it. Some of the rules is quite good and some of it I can not understand why they did some of the rules that way (the consolidation rules CC is perhaps the worst thing I can think of at the top of my head).

But talking to present and former GW employees as well as the higher ups, I come to the conclusion that this is a necessary evil that must be done at this moment.

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Old 31 May 2008, 14:37   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Will 5th Ed fix the REAL problem with 40k

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daemonette Embrace
5ED is faster. But unfortunately I believe it is tailored to a younger audience.
40k needs to be directed to a younger audience. Sadly, the hobby is losing popularity. Potential players ask themselves, "Hmm, do I want to spend a lot of money on rule books, terrain, and little plastic people that I then have to paint, all just to play a game, or do I want to buy a cheap, cool looking, easy to use videogame?" And while the modeling portion draws some people in, it too is losing popularity.

So GW notices all this, and what do they do? Create a game that young, new players will find appealing, so that when all the current hobbyists move on, some one is left to keep our company in business. It's a sad thing, but really, I don't blame them. :'(
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Old 31 May 2008, 20:04   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Will 5th Ed fix the REAL problem with 40k

Losing popularity, as in, what?!?

40k has never been bigger, nor more anticipated! Of course, some people fall off in the end, and new join. Some like some aspects, but dislike others. As the game changes, so does the audience - Just because the game has a faster pace allowing me to go through more than a single game in a day - I'm all for it.

There is a tendency that this is "dumbing down". Besides, IMO, codex eldar is better than ever.
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Old 31 May 2008, 22:05   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
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Default Re: Will 5th Ed fix the REAL problem with 40k

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daemonette Embrace
5ED is faster. But unfortunately I believe it is tailored to a younger audience. The Dumbing Down Aspect is not just coming down from WarSeer but from other web sites as well.

IF GW would have left the concept of being able to customize your army with wargear and traits, there will be less grumbling from the vets with 5ED.

I know why they did it. Some of the rules is quite good and some of it I can not understand why they did some of the rules that way (the consolidation rules CC is perhaps the worst thing I can think of at the top of my head).

But talking to present and former GW employees as well as the higher ups, I come to the conclusion that this is a necessary evil that must be done at this moment.
What makes you think 5th Ed will be faster? (I hope it is.) I'm just curious... have you played it yet?

Why is it a necessary evil? ...And why only at this moment? Can you clarify? Oh, and how do get to hangout with GW higher ups?

I definitely want the game play to be faster paced.

... I just don't see how the new LOS and Assault rules will accomplish that.

As far as others comments are concerned; the "dumbed-down" aspect of things I am an advocate for a streamlined rule system. Complex rules do not make a game good. Chess is one of the best strategy games in the world, and chess' rule set is simple. I don't believe a game needs to be complicated to be good.

It is important that each race plays differently and has a unique feel or else we all end up playing the same army with different models. But you can accomplish that without an overly complex rule system.

I would love to be able to show up at a tournament with a 2000 point army and be able to play four or five games in one day.
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Old 31 May 2008, 22:15   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Will 5th Ed fix the REAL problem with 40k

From everything I've read in the book, 5th Edition is more tactical and requires smarter movement. I mean, do any of you have proof for your claims that it is "dumber"? Or did one of you start chirping that, and the other dodos pick up the call?
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Old 01 Jun 2008, 06:12   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Will 5th Ed fix the REAL problem with 40k

My Bunker actually has the hard cover rules...I think its too early to say its being dumbed down, and my inclination is to say its a bit faster. Things like the universal quasi-fleet are very nice, and Im damn glad rending got toned down a slight bit.

Relax, and play it. The rumors are, on the whole, fairly accurate, but a little simplification isnt a bad thing. Think of it as less worrying about stupid stuff, not actually a lack of options.
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