Tau Empire Codex 2013 | Army Builder Program
Dark Angels Codex 2013
Chaos Daemons Codex 2013
Chaos Space Marines Codex 2012

Warhammer 40k Forum Tau Online

 

Warhammer 40K Forum

Space Marine Hating
Closed Thread
Old 03 Mar 2006, 23:52   #21 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Fort Plain, NY
Posts: 1,671
Send a message via AIM to Grunt90 Send a message via MSN to Grunt90 Send a message via Yahoo to Grunt90
Default Re: Space Marine Hating

actually my tau are extremely well at 400. i kill chaos like nothing, and i mainly use kroot with trees. you justneed to know how to fight em.
__________________
"...And in that time of darkness, man became beast and beast became man."


"Horn and hoof, power is there. Not feeble smoothskin, clumsy greenskin, wicked elf-swine. Gor is strong, Gor is true. Gor shall kill all, slay all for the gods!"

Beastlord Gorthor




Survivor of the 06' Battle Royale!
Grunt90 is offline  
Old 04 Mar 2006, 00:15   #22 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: New York U.S.A.
Posts: 185
Default Re: Space Marine Hating

I like marines okay. I think the 'hate marines' comes from many people seeing 5 marine armies for every 1 non-marine army, and often played by people who aren't much fun to play with. They are IMO an extremely superior army point-for-point, very forgiving and flexible, and kind of a no-brainer in their use, but they have their weaknesses too.

On the plus side, I love the soul of the marines. They are just so full of character and cool fluffy appeal. I just wish that there weren't so many marine armies. Variety is more fun.
__________________
million worlds, unnumbered souls, and a lasgun for every one of them.
squigs for dinner is offline  
Old 04 Mar 2006, 00:26   #23 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southern California
Posts: 5,117
Send a message via MSN to arguleon-veq
Default Re: Space Marine Hating

I really like Marines.

I can understand people not liking them because they get more coverage, there are so many Marine armies out there etc.

BUT

I really can not fathom how anybody can say Marines are beardy. You give me a Marine army you think is beardy and i'll give you one that is far worse for almost every race going. Marines are one of the most balanced armies in the game. Marines are IMO THE hardest army to fully master in the game, 4 of my 6 losses have come when I've been using my Salamanders or Violators. I have a much harder time using a balanced Marine list against good players than I do using Orks, Eldar etc.

I doubt if there is a Marine list going that would make me worry before a game where I am using one of my competative armies [Orks or Eldar], there are plenty of Chaos, Eldar, Guard, Tau, Nid lists that would worry me. Where I would think 'I'm going to have a really hard time here'.

__________________
Brunettes and Beer.
arguleon-veq is offline  
Old 04 Mar 2006, 03:07   #24 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Brampton Ont. Canada
Posts: 6,441
Default Re: Space Marine Hating

Theres just too many marine players around IMO. I mean I see almost half the armies at big tournaments being some flavour of marine. What bothers me even more is that instead of trying to get people to play something other than marines, GW seems to just push them more and more.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mitch: the noob
Is it just me, or does Fish Ead really love to use a Dreadsock?...
I'd hate to get on his bad side... >
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiwaz
Fishy has just proved to me that Canadians CAN be scary...
Fish Ead is offline  
Old 04 Mar 2006, 04:12   #25 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Sydney Aus
Posts: 7,853
Send a message via MSN to crazedmongoose2003
Default Re: Space Marine Hating

Well most people are bitter because for every non spacemarine update there's 10 spacemarine or spacemarine variant update and for every xenos army there's 20 spacemarine or chaos spacemarine army. The fact is that the average human is supposed to be the basic stat line has become drastically below average due to the fact that the most popular race is Spacemarines, followed at second place by Chaos spacemarines, and thats not mentioning Necrons, Deamon Hunters, Witch Hunters etc.


But I love the average spacemarine players, they ensure I have a constant supply of incompetent commanders to absolutely decimate on the playing feild when i just don't feel like a challenge or getting my rear end handed to the local IG or Dark Eldar guru. (Call me a bad sport, cos I know I am, but I play 40k to relax and feel good, getting beaten doesn't make me feel good. Personally for me, concentration and devotion is for school, work, exams, not for part time recreational hobbies...)


Now, veteran spacemarines commanders, are something else completely. They're around 1 in 100 but are absolutely devastating on the battlefeild. Ironically a lot of them learnt to play with another race first and then moved on the spacemarines.


Reason? Spacemarines are too good simply. A spacemarine player playing a non spacemarine player of the same skill realistically would win most of the time. Almost every single rule becomes an exception when you're spacemarine. Open topped vehicles are no longer open topped, you can rally under half strength, you can't get run down.....its just ridiculous.


However this is a double edged sword in reality. Because SM are so compromising and so forgiving, your SM player will not learn the hard way and be forced to suffer an exponential learning curve. They're the ones who even though having played for 2-3 years, still do not use cover, or coherent assaults, or carefully measure range, or use any semblance of strategy beyond army list making and "this attacks that" , simply because they've come to the mentality that anything any other army can feild SM can feild a better unit (and that's true for the majority), but when they come up against an opponent who knows his stuff, they'l be in trouble.


Thus in summary

SM rookie beats Xenos rookie
Xenos average beats SM average
SM veteran and Xenos veteran are equal, there's no overall trend there
__________________
Holding a Tau Online Vassal League, click here for more info:

http://forums.tauonline.org/index.ph...c,86474.0.html
crazedmongoose2003 is offline  
Old 04 Mar 2006, 04:19   #26 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,891
Default Re: Space Marine Hating

I dislike them for two main reasons:

1) They seem unbalanced. Things like the land speeder not being open toped and the black Templar codex are just overdone.

2) Their aesthetic style seems.... childish. They look like gothic storm troopers (star wars).

Of course, this is all just personal preference.

Heh. Goth trooper.
the_vilest_worm is offline  
Old 04 Mar 2006, 05:26   #27 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
Bash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Western Australia
Posts: 2,625
Send a message via MSN to Bash
Default Re: Space Marine Hating

There's two sides of this for me :P

First, there's the statement that I HATE SPACE MARINES;

I hate the fact that Games Workshop never shuts up about them. I know this is reasonable and justified, but that doesn't mean I like it. Think of it as a criminal getting away with murder because of a legal technicality, sure it's okay because it's the law...but that doesn't make it right. There are far too few options for every Xenos race and while the Imperium is the focal point of the game (you can't now say the Imperial Guard and Inquisition aren't unsupported- they have so many variations that it's not funny, they're just not as popular...which is a good thing). I hate that lots of 'sheep' play them. There's nothing wrong with loving an image or an ideal that Space Marines embody, but there's love and then there's fanboyism. They are the biggest fanboy race in the game. People seem to think they should win just because they play Space Marines. They are the 'best' so if they lose in a battle against Xenos, they clearly have been cheated or the Xenos list is broken. This attitude is quite prevalant amongst Marine players and in general, it is the poor gamers and in fact UNDER-ATTENTION Games Workshop gives Xenos in terms of rules updates and models that which lets Marines cop all the flak.

On the other hand, there's the fact that, funnily enough, I LIKE SPACE MARINES;

Space Marines DO have character. You can't deny it. Space Wolves are big drunk vikings in space, Blood Angels are Italian renaissance vampires, Black Templars are crazy Teutonic Knights crusading about the place and so forth. It's hard not to like at least one or two of these groups. I did play a Flesh Tearers army for a very long time and I absolutely adore them. I intend to later even play Deathwatch and Scythes of the Emperor because I think they're badarse. Space Marines ARE easy to paint and cheap to collect. They're also easy to learn and while I don't believe that you should be able to field an army that is set to 'beginner' to give you a bonus when you start out, but really...powergamers exist in all races and if you're crazy like me, you think everyone that plays differently to you is a powegamer. I live with it, so should you. Seriously, Space Marines do have a kewl image but they aren't the ONLY part of 40k...

So overall?

I am glad that I don't play Space Marines anymore. I'm proud I can play armies of all kinds with every possible configuration you can imagine (all-combat footslogger Orks, Imperial Guard cityfighters, crazy Inquisitors, speedy mech Tau etc) and that they are all awesome armies. Guess what? I'd be just as proud of my armies if I played Flesh Tearers still. I love them too. Games Workshop cops a fair bit of flak from me and I believe it deserves it, but I don't HATE Games Workshop, I just miss the good old days and when the company wasn't so ridiculously profit-driven to the extent of isolating gamer groups for the sake of pure revenue from Space Marine sales. This isn't the fault of 'real' Marine players, they are neither arrogant but unskilled nor is it their fault Games Workshop floods their ranks with annoying fanboys.

I don't like Space Marines because I don't play them at the moment.

Space Marines ignore practically every rule in the game and are great at everything, while having specialists that make things even easier to do (ie a unit that kills everything in combat or one that kills everything with shooting or, if that's not good enough, a unit that does BOTH).

The very few talented and experienced Space Marine commanders often hate the masses of other gamers in their category just as much, if not more, than I do.


Games Workshop doesn't support other codices as well as they should. This is the fault of the game system and it will never change forseeably.
__________________
~Codex: Not Marines gamer~

Currently playing: Imperial Guard in 40k, Chaos in Fantasy
Bash is offline  
Old 04 Mar 2006, 05:55   #28 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: cleveland oh
Posts: 496
Default Re: Space Marine Hating

I like my marines. Other armies have units that are more specialized, shooty guys( both close range and long range varieties), and close combat guys, maneuverable guys, High leadership guys, etc..
The beauty of marines is that each squad of marines can have a primary and secondary role in your battle plan. They may not be the best in the game for each specific task, but they are capable of filling many battlefield roles. When your Tank hunting venerable dread goes down to a seeker missile, this hurts but the tactical squads can still pose a threat and controll ground at the same time. If that fails then the assault marines with meltbombs can be pulled off their juicy target to meet armored threats. Because marines are versatile, you can use them to decide what aspect of the game works for you:assault, armor, shooty troops; and decide from there which army you will play next. You may discover, as i have, that you really like marines.
__________________
It is all fun and games until someone takes it too seriously
greensmurf is offline  
Old 04 Mar 2006, 09:19   #29 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,207
Default Re: Space Marine Hating

Space Marines have some of the coolest fluff in the game. They are the embodiment of the gothic/awesome atmosphere of the 40K universe. They are warrior monks who have no thoughts in there mind but those of faith and conflict.

Sample SM quotes: Bless the mind too small for doubt
A narrow view sees better
Clense! Purge! Kill!

They are Gothic Templar Warriors, with big guns and cool suits.

Watch the Dawn of War opening cinematic and then tell me you don't like marines. Listen to the DOW chaplain's lines and then tell me you don't like Marines. If you can do either of these things, I salute you. (Before I played that game I was determined to hate Marines!)

The reason I didn't pick them is......... Tau look cooler. And have Battlesuits. And I wanted to avoid being labelled "another Smurf Noob" at all costs.
__________________


There is no such thing as a plea of innocence in my court. A plea of innocence is guilty of wasting my time. Guilty.
- Inquisitor Lord Karamazov

What do you humans know of our pain? We have sang songs of lament since before your ancestors crawled on their bellies from the sea - Eldrad Ulthran
Faolin is offline  
Old 04 Mar 2006, 12:04   #30 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Coloma
Posts: 1,463
Default Re: Space Marine Hating

Go ahead, call me a SMurf Noob, just remember that I'm the commander thats handing your butt back to you on a silver plate. What you don't realize is that those "noobs" that are charging you straight ahead with their marines, not taking cover, also most likely never had a good teacher.

My first army was marines under 2nd edition, then I moved to chaos because I was shown what a bloodthirster could do in hand to hand.

Third edition came out and I played my marines again, until I fell in love with orks (then dark eldar, then chaos again, then eldar). But the funny thing was no matter what army I played I was accused of having a cheesy army (because we know that 4 full troop choices in any army is cheesy) so I went back to my marines.

Then the Tau came out. The day they were released I bought every model I could, and as the new units came out I would buy full units of those. I could play 2000 pt battles and have enough models to vary what I wanted to take. Again everyone started to call me cheesy. "The Hammer Head can do what?"

So finally I've given up hope and gone back to my first army, only this time I want to have more fun with it. I now have a 2500 pt deathwing army. Cheesy? Not really, but I know I'll be accused of it so I don't care.

I've learned the hard way that no matter what army you play someone will always complain about it being a cheesy army. Eldar have how many starcannons, wait the necrons can get back up, how fast are the dark eldar, don't get into hand to hand with the tyranids (Orks, blood angels, space wolves etc..) make sure to get into hand to hand with the tau, your Imp. guard have how many tanks?

While the space marines can be abused, so can every other army, and as far as GW giving too much to the space marines and not enough to the other armies, think of it like this: you own a business that produces two products. The first product outsells the second one 2:1. Which one of the two are you going to put more resources into? While they will still promote other armies (too many people out there who like the other armies) they will continue to produce more marine supplements and products because most of their money coming in from 40k is from the marines. You want to change that, then start buying more of the other armies.
__________________
To blindly follow others is to live the life of a lemming. Be yourself, no matter what others may say.
Howloutloud is offline  
Closed Thread

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Differences of a Space Marine Part I: Tactical Marine & Scout arandomshadow Space Marines 12 15 Sep 2008 18:16
Space Marine help (For new space marine players) Adamblaze Space Marines 9 16 Jan 2008 22:41
Opponents hating Tau Ninja Snarl Tau 157 11 Jan 2008 01:57
hating life? azr9 Serious Debate and Discussion 50 17 Mar 2006 23:12
School hating Aun_shaun Serious Debate and Discussion 30 05 Feb 2006 20:16