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A hidden gem? Possessed and 5th edition
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Old 09 Jul 2008, 19:41   #1 (permalink)
Anton
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Default A hidden gem? Possessed and 5th edition

Heya,

On my travels through the internet I lurk on other 40k forums, and it was whilst I was lurking the Chaos boards on the Bolter & Chainsword that I discovered the hidden potential in the Possessed, and how 5th edition has the key to unlock it. Allow me to explain.

Many people have dismissed Codex Chaos Space Marines as a "nerf," which in 4th edition it is, but the GW design team designed the Codex in prepration for 5th edition, and now that the release date is practically on our doorsteps, we can see now that many units we regarded as "useless" are now in-fact of use, one of those being the Possessed. I'll admit that for a long time I disliked the Codex, and I was in agreement that GW had pulled us Chaos Space Marine players over their lap and spanked us for being so horrifically beardy with the last edition, but now that I have a perfect understating of 5th edition, I honestly believe that the Chaos Space Marine army will benefit massively from 5th edition.

With 5th edition the Possessed will become of use because:
  • Scouts: Once the most hated of results, Scouts will now become the most wanted when 5th edition arrives. Any unit that has the infiltrate or scouts ability can remain in reserve, and once they become available you roll a D6, on a 1-2 they enter the game from the short board edge on your left, on a 3-4 to your right, and on a 5-6 you can choose which side to enter the game. Now your Possessed will be right on the flanks of the enemy, able to strike vulnerable or powerful enemy units without risking heavy causalities by slogging up the board. [This tactic is invalid, as it contradicts with the rule regarding the Daemonic Abilities.]
  • Run: Whilst this rule wouldn't benefit a Possessed squad with the Fleet ability, for any other ability Run is a great way to close with the enemy quicker, although you cannot assault after making a Run, it's still better than nothing, and could very well spare you casualties and time.
  • Dedicated Transports: In 5th edition Transport are no longer restricted to transporting their parents squad, which is a great advantage for the Possessed, and that you can utilise other Rhino's to bring the Possessed to where they are needed, or if a flank is in danger of being overrun etc...
  • Vehicle Damage: In 5th edition when you assault a vehicle you always hit the rear armour, which is much more realistic and makes the Possessed more worthwhile, especially if they get the Rending ability! Of course this is not a notable advantage, this rule can be used by all Infantry units, but this new rule makes Possessed just that bit more effective.

That's all I can think of at the moment, so what are your thoughts? Do you think the Possessed will be a worthwhile unit in 5th edition? Or will you stick with the alternatives? Discuss away!
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Old 09 Jul 2008, 19:52   #2 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: A hidded gem? Possessed and 5th edition

Great counter assault unit too, as 5th is all about troops Possessed can just plough into anything threatening your troops or just charge the enemies troops.
I've always like them, they're cool, ^_^
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Old 09 Jul 2008, 19:57   #3 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: A hidded gem? Possessed and 5th edition

you where on other forums......?

I still see the possessed as being rob from us and their new rules doesn't make for competertive play. your view are valead and I will have to watch out for them in the future but I hardly see this as a relaiably tactic.

I still dislike the new codex.

KQD - poor spelling tonight
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Old 09 Jul 2008, 20:04   #4 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: A hidded gem? Possessed and 5th edition

Everyone dislikes the new codex compared to the old one,

The old one was too powerful, so they toned it down, I find it fairer now.

Possessed are meant to be random, not an entire unit with rending claws _
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Old 09 Jul 2008, 20:13   #5 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Re: A hidded gem? Possessed and 5th edition

Scouts is definitely a benefit. Furious charge is still the same. Fleet does not gain any benefit form the run rule but you can still charge after running. Rending is worse since you are only ws 4 you Will not be getting enough rending hits to kill marines in great numbers.
Feel no pain is still a great ability but it bad vs plasma guns now but still vs AP 3 weapons we still have the same chance of surviving as a normal marine does against a worse than AP 3 weapon. Feel no pain is still not a weak ability it just got a little bit weaker.
Power weapon is still one of the best powers seeing as you get a strength 5 power weapon which is hard to get other than in berserkers squads and impossible if you do not play khrone. Also the possessed will never run form battle. Also another downside is the icons are more expensive for possesed than termies.

Also remember all of the other options like termies also get run.
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Old 09 Jul 2008, 20:22   #6 (permalink)
Anton
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Default Re: A hidded gem? Possessed and 5th edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor Wu
Also another downside is the icons are more expensive for possesed than termies.

Also remember all of the other options like termies also get run.
As you stated, the Possessed are Fearless, and this is one of the worthwhile advantages they have over Chaos Terminators. Whilst Chaos Terminators outclass the Possessed in many fields, they run the great risk of failing a morale check or pinning test, whilst the Possessed will fight to the absolute last. Even with a Leadership of 10, enough modifiers will see them off and will leave you quite red in the face. :P
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Old 09 Jul 2008, 20:34   #7 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: A hidded gem? Possessed and 5th edition

Scouts
Yes this will now become useful rather than a waste, the one good new thing for possessed in 5th.

Run
Yes they can now run, but if you rolled fleet this will make no difference. Another thing to look at is that berserkers also benefit from run and are a better more reliable unit.

Dedicated Transports
You can use any free transport to pick up the possessed and ferry them around which is nice. Yet again though berserkers benefit from this as well.

As Doctor Wu mentioned feel no pain has had a nerf, now any shooting attacks that rend and AP1+2 weapons ignore it now. You also have rending which has taken a big hit (fine by me) which was one of their best ability's. Overall they have had a few minor improvements but they have lost at least as much (if not more) as they have gained. Khorne beserkers were a better option in 4th, in 5th they benefit from most of the improvements that possessed do and suffer none of the nerfs and since they are troops they are also scoring units (unlike possessed). Beserkers were better and cheaper in 4th and will remain so in 5th!

edit- The one thing I do like about possessed are the models, they are very nice and far better than the beserkers. That said good old FW has made some amazing new beserker models.
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Old 09 Jul 2008, 20:44   #8 (permalink)
Anton
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Default Re: A hidded gem? Possessed and 5th edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sardis Varrn
Beserkers were better and cheaper in 4th and will remain so in 5th!
Whilst Berzerkers have Furious Charge, they do not benefit from a fixed Strength of 5 compared to the Possessed, they also do not have a 5+ Inv. Save (which is better than nothing!) and can also benefit from a randomly determined advantage. Berzerkers are a specialist combat unit, whilst Possessed are better suited as flankers, assassins, counter attackers and can also destroy vehicles much easier in combat with 5th edition, especially if they get the Rending ability!

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Old 09 Jul 2008, 20:52   #9 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: A hidden gem? Possessed and 5th edition

The invulnerable save was always nice but with cover saves being so easy to get in 5th it loses some of its value. Their random advantage isn't that great most of the time as its rolled for after you have deployed the unit but before the first turn so you can't plan what your doing with them. Just thinking about it, this also means that possessed WONT be able to outflank as you roll for their ability after they are on the board and by then its to late to remove them! I still think that the only way that possessed would be a better choice that beserkers is if you roll for their ability and get power weapons, but you only have a one in six chance of getting that.
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Old 09 Jul 2008, 21:02   #10 (permalink)
Anton
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Default Re: A hidden gem? Possessed and 5th edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sardis Varrn
Just thinking about it, this also means that possessed WONT be able to outflank as you roll for their ability after they are on the board and by then its to late to remove them!
Hmm, so according to the Codex you roll for the abilities table after deployment, but in order to outflank the enemy you need the Scout rule, but then to outflank you need to keep the Possessed in reserve, therefore they're not deployed thus they can't use Scouts as they technically don't have it.

And GW didn't think to cover that in their FAQ...



Quote:
Originally Posted by Sardis Varrn
I still think that the only way that possessed would be a better choice that beserkers is if you roll for their ability and get power weapons, but you only have a one in six chance of getting that.
Instead of relying on the cubes of misfortune (dice) GW should have left the possessed as they were, you buy the upgrades instead of allowing that whore known as lady luck to decide for you. :P
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