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Regular SM worth it?
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Old 25 Feb 2008, 13:38   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Regular SM worth it?

So, I'm considering starting a CSM army and I picked up the codex. Here's my thought; the specialist troops (plague marines, berzerkers, noise marines, & thousand sons) are so good that is it ever worth it to use the regular CSMs?! From my perspective, CSMs are excellent for their point-cost, but the other troop options seem even better! Perhaps there is a particular task that they are ideal for?
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Old 25 Feb 2008, 13:58   #2 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Regular SM worth it?

I say no. Fearlessness is too good. Get Cult troops for all your needs.
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Old 25 Feb 2008, 15:03   #3 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Regular SM worth it?

It is true that the cult troops are good at what they do, but they are all expensive and are highly specialized. The CSM has always been a highly dependable unit that can be made to fit a variance of situations at a much cheaper price. I guess the main point is that normal CSM can be configured to fit almost any situation. Besides, if you lose a unit of these guys to dark reapers, who cares? You should have another one or two units all ready to go. But Khorne forbid you should lose the berserkers you paid so much for to their fire power.
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Old 25 Feb 2008, 15:08   #4 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
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Default Re: Regular SM worth it?

The cult troops are not for the faint-hearted. They cost a lot for what they can do, and for that cost you can buy at 1.5 Chaos Space Marines. And for their limited weaponry, they are much harder to use. Most require that they are mounted in Rhinos and be used aggressively as compared to the more conventional Chaos Space Marines.

For beginners, I say go for the Chaos Space Marines. If you know what you ar getting into and demand extreme efficiency in one pareticular aspect, go with the Cult troopers.
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Old 27 Feb 2008, 12:17   #5 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Regular SM worth it?

No.

Don't listen to that 'beginners' argument for regular CSMs. While cult troops are more specialised, it's only relative to marines and it's only slight. They're still first and foremost power armoured space marines who can dish out good shooting and close combat and take a hit as well as anyone. Beginner and veteran alike should go for cult troops if they want the best that the codex offers.

And there is no specific task that regular CSM are ideal for. Their flexibility is their best claim.
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Old 27 Feb 2008, 19:38   #6 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Regular SM worth it?

I am not a beginner anyway, so I think that I will avoid wasting any money on regular CSMs altogether. Thanks!
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Old 27 Feb 2008, 20:36   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Regular SM worth it?

It is important to note that the regular CSM are some of the best infantry units in the game, for their points. Two CC weapons, a bolter, frag grenades, and krak grenades all for the cost of a regular SM. Add to that the cheaper rhinos, Icons, and unit options, and you get a solid, powerful unit on the cheap. You want a take all comers unit? Look no further.

It is also important to note that the cult troops are way cool. And can be used to devastating effect (usually moreso than the basic CSM) in their field of expertise.

You should take whichever you like better, but be prepared for a slightly more challenging fight if you bring cult troops, because they are less versatile.
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Old 28 Feb 2008, 13:58   #8 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
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Default Re: Regular SM worth it?

No one is knocking basic CSM's. As you say, they are one of the game's best troop choices. Unfortunately, all 4 cult choices are even better.
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Old 28 Feb 2008, 23:44   #9 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
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Default Re: Regular SM worth it?

Next question: how would you rank the cult troops? My guess just from reading the codex and without ever actually playing them is:

1. Plague (extremely hard to kill)
2. Thousand Sons (AP3 weapons and they can still shoot 24", even after moving)
3. Khorne (bad-@$$ in CC!)
4. Noise (excellent fire-power, though possibly a bit too expensive)
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Old 29 Feb 2008, 03:52   #10 (permalink)
Shas'Ui
 
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Default Re: Regular SM worth it?

Yeah, I would probably rank them similarly.

However, I suppose I consider Berzerkers and Thousand Sons to be tied for 2nd, depending on the rest of your army's composition. I think you could build your army to make Thousand Sons more devastating... but that style of list building is not for everyone.

And I agree that Noise Marines are too expensive by one, maybe two, points. The increased initiative plus access to brilliant guns just makes them too schizophrenic. I wish they'd just drop the whole increased initiative thing completely and drop their base cost by two points. At the very least they should have made the sonic blasters a bit more expensive (not the blastmaster though, it's already overpriced) and taken the additional cost off the base cost of the noise marine.
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