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What am I doing Wrong?
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Old 10 Aug 2007, 03:42   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
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Default What am I doing Wrong?

OK here's the deal, I'm fairly new to the game been playing since about march. I've got a tyranid army a chaos and a tau the focus here of course being my chaos.
I carry at all times my daemon prince he's a monstrous khornate bezerker glaive wielding close combat machine
then normally a cheap 100 pt flying lord, squad of 8 berzerkers (chain axes) about 26 chaos space marines in 2 groups of 8 and a 10 squad in a rhino, also i have 4 bikers (khornate) and a land raider
my normal strategy at this point is hold back anything with range to shoot as much as possible and move my close combat squads (bikes, lords, rhino squad, bezerkers) up and try to get to close combat before i get shot too much.
The problem is i never seem to reach CC fast enough and lose a significant portion of my CC forces making it near impossible to clear them out before losing, as seams to happen alot
Ive played games against all sorts of armies and always seem to lose i went to grand tournament and got 1 win out of 6 games and 1 draw, i seem to do my best against deathwing armies (win) and ultramarines (draw)
any advice on what i should do to increase my kill ratios my close combat squads die by shooting and my shooting squads die in close combat its horrid!
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Old 10 Aug 2007, 17:49   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: What am I doing Wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zahrim
I carry at all times my daemon prince he's a monstrous khornate berserker glaive wielding close combat machine
then normally a cheap 100 pt flying lord
Well right there thats illegal. No lord and DP.... at least until the new dex comes out.



Quote:
The problem is i never seem to reach CC fast enough and lose a significant portion of my CC forces making it near impossible to clear them out before losing, as seams to happen alot
Well theres the pickle. Now I see a couple viable options.

1) BIKES BIKES BIKES!!! Some great fast CC weapons. Maybe some meltas for anti tank.

2) RHINOS RHINOS RHINOS!!! Load up every Berserker squad in a Rhino. Somewhat Risky and alot of stuff that can go wrong but hey its fast.

3) Play Kosher World Eaters. This I think is your best bet. Get as many Khorne Berserkers with infiltrate and Bikes on the table. Make the bikes your antitank with those meltas and lose that Land Raider for a pred or 2.

Now WEs are not a shooty army, so don't play them like one. Use your bikes to flank and fire upon tanks, then smash into the enemies' ranks. Very Dark Eldar'eque tactic, but I know it works. Start your Baedekers close, wether it be through Rhinos or Infiltrate (I reccomend the former as Infiltrate will soon be a thing of the past). Then, finally have a tank or 2 in the back cleaning up the bigger pieces. Maybe a defiler will be a thing to invest in, (I'd reccomend a vindicator when the new dex comes out); just something that has a blast marker. Finally scrap the Land Raider, it does nothing for except take up space and points. It could be useful if you had some termies to carry in it, but other wise its just waaay to useless for what it costs.
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Old 10 Aug 2007, 17:55   #3 (permalink)
Aun
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Default Re: What am I doing Wrong?

Quote:
Get as many Khorne Berserkers with infiltrate
Sorry, but guys with the mark of Khorne can't infiltrate.
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Old 10 Aug 2007, 17:58   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: What am I doing Wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by E7 (Aun)
Quote:
Get as many Khorne Berserkers with infiltrate
Sorry, but guys with the mark of Khorne can't infiltrate.
Ok, well I thought that, I blazed through the codex and coudnt find where it said that so I just went for it. Nothing really changes, as infiltrate was gone in the new dex anyway. Rhinos and bikes are the way to go.
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Old 10 Aug 2007, 19:57   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: What am I doing Wrong?

play your squads with mark of nurgle that way you get your enemy pissed off at you with your high toughness example: vs my freinds tau i got 2 of my squads in without casualties then wrecked havoc behind his front lines in CC he couldnt touch me
also throw your berserkers in rhinos risky but fast and hard to take down.
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Old 11 Aug 2007, 03:12   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: What am I doing Wrong?

I have had that problem a lot with my Khorne army. I have come to learn that try not to make your Daemon Prince with the mark of Khorne. It defeats strategy and makes it extremely difficult to really do anything. (In other words, the Berserker Glaive hurts you more then helps) And like Lord Syphilis says, use bikes, they make things move a little faster.
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Old 11 Aug 2007, 07:05   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: What am I doing Wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord Syphilis
Now WEs are not a shooty army, so don't play them like one.
Actually, I wouldn't call this a World Eater force, this is khornate black legion. And that means that you can definitely incorporate some shooty support.

First thing: how are your regular chaos marines set up? ie special weapons, aspiring champion, etc?

Under the current rules and sticking basically to the models you already have:

I'd set your 3 non-khornate marine units up with some special weapons - good old las/plas set up should do - and give them infiltrate.

Make your lord into a lieutenant (if you have him as a lord, you cannot have a daemon prince - it's against the rules). Give HIM the daemon weapon, i'd recommend the dark blade, keep the wings, DON'T give him mark of khorne and instead give him infiltrate, might as well give him daemonic resilience if he can afford it at this point (50 point limit on daemonic gifts).

Get rid of your daemon princes berserker glaive (you HAVE to get rid of it if you give the dark blade to the Ltn anyway). Just let him have a regular close combat weapon, and give him daemonic speed. Add whatever else you want if you have points left over - daemonic resilience is recommended - but he is a beast at this point anyway.

Keep the bikes, they're cool.

Put your berseker squad in the rhino that you had been using for the regular marine squad.

I think the land raider is probably not the best thing for your army, although it could definitely have its uses eg. drawing fire away from your daemon prince. Get another berseker squad to go in it.

Crude strategy:

Throw your lieutenant at whatever infantry squad poses the most threat to your advancing daemon prince. Eg. space marine devastator squads, or squads that have some mass firepower but couldn't stand up to the lord in combat eg. firewarriors. This guy is expendable - it's okay if he dies, just take double his points value to hell along with him.

Use the infiltrating las/plas to try and take out any big heavy weapon units - tanks, dreadnaughts, skimmers, carnifexes etc. Give the aspiring champions a powerfist and they'll hold up okay against most assaults as well, and should be used to hold areas as their secondary functions.

Advance the rest of your army - the prince, the berserkers, the bikes - fast.

The idea is to eliminate or tie up in close combat with your infiltrating units the enemy units that most threaten your advancing khornate units.

Good luck (for the next 4 weeks, at any rate).
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Old 11 Aug 2007, 10:57   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: What am I doing Wrong?

Or for 1000pts, you can do what my friend did.

200+pt Khornate Daemon of doom
Bloodthirster

1 8 man squad of bezerkers on foot w/ furious charge tooled up AC
1 8 Man Squad of bezerkers mounted in rhino. Ac is Daemonhost

Defiler

My friend has over 200 wins with this army, and the only time I have ever come close to defeating it was with Space Wolves. Props go the Space Wolf Scouts, who OBEL'd behind the defiler, took that out, and almost took down the bloodthirster as well. I believe that game came to a draw, with only 2 bezerkers left on the table. It is a very very tough army to beat with three very tough units. I'm not sure how well it will perform now with all these new armies and their fancy gadgets, but it was a very powerful list.

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Old 11 Aug 2007, 16:30   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: What am I doing Wrong?

set up a lieutenant with mark of nurgle daemonic armor and daemonic aura
so hes toughness 5 with a 2+armor save and a 5+ invuln save works realy well once you get him into CC on my first game with one i took out 3 crisis suits and almost half a squad of kroot before dieing. ;D
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Old 12 Aug 2007, 11:13   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: What am I doing Wrong?

Here is the best solution for firepower at least, 3 Obliterators absolutely pawn most things.
Landraiders are best for assault units as you can assault out of them!!!!, on the other hand they are bullet magnets!
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