Tau Empire Codex 2013 | Army Builder Program
Dark Angels Codex 2013
Chaos Daemons Codex 2013
Chaos Space Marines Codex 2012

Warhammer 40k Forum Tau Online

 

Warhammer 40K Forum

Names of Armies vs Names of Soldiers
Closed Thread
Old 14 Dec 2005, 03:39   #1 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 73
Send a message via AIM to amun-her-kepshef
Default Names of Armies vs Names of Soldiers

Here's a question I've had for a while, and it really confused me for a bit when I first started. Maybe someone could enlighten me, or at least provide some kind of suggestion so I won't be depressed. :P

An army that worships Khorne is called a World Eaters Army. A soldier who worships Khorne is called a Khorne Berzerker.
An army that worships Nurgle is called a Death Guard Army. A soldier who worships Nurgle is called a Nurgle Plague Marine.
An army that worships Slaanesh is called an Emperor's Children Army. A soldier who worships Slaanesh is called a Slaanesh Noise Marine (at least in current fluff. I understand that Noise Marines used to be special guys within the general EC).
An army that worships Tzeentch is called a Thousand Sons Army. A soldier who worships Tzeentch is called a........Thousand Son. ???

I know it might sound dumb, but when I started 40K, as a TS player, I looked at the other armies and was confused by the disparity in the other Cults between the titles of the soldiers and of their armies. Is there a reason the TS don't get a different name, like the others? Has it always been this way (I started near the end of 3rd)? Is there a legitimate reason, or is this yet another instance proving Matt Haines' supposed comment that the Book of Tzeentch wasn't fully (or at all, really) playtested and revised to make it good and balanced before publication?

Thanks for anything anyone can provide. I'm trying to be optimistic here, and hoping I'm just missing some nugget of wisdom from old fluff. (crosses fingers)

*Note that this is not a TS-bashing/whining-fest. We all know all the gripes about the TS, and I'm not here to rehash them. This is just a thought and question that re-occurred to me recently, and I think it's a justified one.*
__________________
Aqua Teen Hunger Force Fan Numero Uno, Baby.

"What's the difference between an optimist and a pessimist?
An optimist says 'The drink is half full.'
A pessimist says 'The drink is half full. But I might have colon cancer.' "
-The Kids in the Hall

amun-her-kepshef is offline  
Old 14 Dec 2005, 16:58   #2 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Milwaukee
Posts: 21
Default Re: Names of Armies vs Names of Soldiers

rubric marine
__________________
Penny are like pesos the more u have the less u want
Patlbor_666 is offline  
Old 14 Dec 2005, 17:02   #3 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Alachua, Florida
Posts: 8,647
Send a message via MSN to MalVeauX
Default Re: Names of Armies vs Names of Soldiers

As Patlabor put it, the "Rubric Marines" are the Thousand Sons.

However, for a reason, perhaps it has something to do with the fact that those marines aren't "there." They're just dust inside of armor, unlike the Plague, Noise and Berserker Marines, who all still have names and all. For the Thousand Sons, they're just automatons, who follow their sorcerer masters. Ghosts, if you will.

There may be another reason for them not having a name like the others; but I would assume it has something to do with who they are.

Cheers!
__________________
[table][tr][td][/td][td][table][tr][td] [/td][td]Apocalypse is the only way to forty-kay.[/td][/tr][/table][/td][/tr][/table]
MalVeauX is offline  
Old 14 Dec 2005, 17:16   #4 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 73
Send a message via AIM to amun-her-kepshef
Default Re: Names of Armies vs Names of Soldiers

Well, "Rubric Marines" is just an improvised name that players have come up with. The Codex never mentions the term "Rubric Marines," so I have to assume that it's not what they're actually called. Any soldier who worships Tzeentch is not a Rubric Marine. Those are only the non-Sorcerer ones. So "Thousand Son" would be the catch-all term for any soldier who worships Tzeentch, which then gets divided into Rubrics and non-Rubrics/Sorcerers.

And the thought had crossed my mind that it might be because they're not there, like you said, Malveaux. But then what are the Sorcerers called? Thousand Sons? Well that's just not original at all, and unoriginality on that scale leaves a bad taste in my mouth. :P But, if that's the way it goes, then that's that, I guess. :-\
__________________
Aqua Teen Hunger Force Fan Numero Uno, Baby.

"What's the difference between an optimist and a pessimist?
An optimist says 'The drink is half full.'
A pessimist says 'The drink is half full. But I might have colon cancer.' "
-The Kids in the Hall

amun-her-kepshef is offline  
Old 14 Dec 2005, 17:34   #5 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Alachua, Florida
Posts: 8,647
Send a message via MSN to MalVeauX
Default Re: Names of Armies vs Names of Soldiers

Everything I've read points towards them simply being called the "Thousand Sons." The sorcerers are just that, sorcerers and they too are the thousand sons, they merely do not bear the curse of the Rubric. It makes sense to me in a way, simply because if they're not there, like Ghosts in Shells, they're just a bunch of the same, in uniformity, and so are refer ed to simply as the Thousand Sons, since there's no point in naming them. What would we name them after all? They have no special traits, other than they bear the Rubric, which is why most people refer to them as Rubric Marines. It was created and used in the same sense that "Plague Marine" is after all. The trait they bear becomes the name.

Overall though, they seem to simply carry the same name, Thousand Sons, due to their lack of individual--they're just the Sorcerers and the Rubric, making up the Thousand Sons, and they are merely the Thousand Sons Marines so to speak.

Cheers!
__________________
[table][tr][td][/td][td][table][tr][td] [/td][td]Apocalypse is the only way to forty-kay.[/td][/tr][/table][/td][/tr][/table]
MalVeauX is offline  
Old 14 Dec 2005, 19:15   #6 (permalink)
Kroot Warrior
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Milwaukee
Posts: 21
Default Re: Names of Armies vs Names of Soldiers

Touche O0

Quote:
Originally Posted by MalVeauX
Patlabor:

Notice this post adds nothing to conversation?
Please attempt to add to the thread.
Feel free to edit your post and add more commentary, ideas, etc.
Also - One word posts are rather frowned upon.

Thanks!
-Mal
__________________
Penny are like pesos the more u have the less u want
Patlbor_666 is offline  
Old 14 Dec 2005, 22:54   #7 (permalink)
Shas'Saal
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Edmonton, Canada
Posts: 125
Default Re: Names of Armies vs Names of Soldiers

They actually are referred to as "Rubric Marines" or as having the "Rubric Sign" in the Chaos 'Dex, in the Tzeentch/Thousand Sons army description.
__________________
O0 <------ This is not a smiley with an afro. Do not think it is. This smiley is about to fall into a deep hole... he shouldn't even be smiling.
Teh N00b is offline  
Old 15 Dec 2005, 00:01   #8 (permalink)
Kroot Shaper
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 73
Send a message via AIM to amun-her-kepshef
Default Re: Names of Armies vs Names of Soldiers

Alright, Mal. I'll accept your explanation.....this time. lol. No, really, thanks. It makes a mite more sense now. I guess I can forgive GW this. ;D

Strychnine: Yes, I'm aware. But being described as having the Rubric Sign and specifically being called "Rubric Marines" are two different things. The point I made to Patlbor, that I'll make again to you, is that "Rubric Marines" is simply a shorthand name gamers have invented for CSM with the Rubric Sign. It's not an official name, so not exactly what I'm looking for, though I appreciate the input. I wasn't asking for something to call them, I was asking why GW gave special names to all the other Cult soldiers, but decided to leave the Tzeentchian ones out, because the term for the TS soldier is the same as the term for the TS army.
__________________
Aqua Teen Hunger Force Fan Numero Uno, Baby.

"What's the difference between an optimist and a pessimist?
An optimist says 'The drink is half full.'
A pessimist says 'The drink is half full. But I might have colon cancer.' "
-The Kids in the Hall

amun-her-kepshef is offline  
Old 15 Dec 2005, 02:51   #9 (permalink)
Shas'Vre
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Hell (Mon-Fri), Heaven (Sat-Sun)
Posts: 1,866
Default Re: Names of Armies vs Names of Soldiers

One big reason why TS get no special troop-type name is because they are unique to the Legion. Not all Plague Marines are in the Death Guard, not all Noise Marines were/are of the Emperor's Children, and not all Khorne Berzerkers originate from the World Eaters Legion. All of these troop types exist in other Traitor legions and Renegade Chapters, or as independent warbands. But 'Rubric Marines' are unique to the Thousand Sons, barring freak occurences like small rebelling groups that split off.

I'm not really too fond of the what the Mark of Tzeentch does for that reason. It's not the Thousand Sons I have a problem with at all, I just wish there was a way to have Tzeentchian CSM that represents the capricious random nature of their God rather than the Legion-specific fluff. Like having some randomizing stats that change from turn to turn, or mutations that can randomly appear and disappear. Or sorcerous weapons perhaps. A MoT like that would definatley give a less Legion-specific flavour to Tzeentchian Marines. I'd want to keep the current 1kSons as a special Troop unit for Thousand Son armies of course.
__________________
We tend to scoff at the beliefs of the ancients. But we can't scoff at them personally, to their faces, and this is what annoys me.

If trees could scream, would we be so cavalier about cutting them down? We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason.

[i]All statements are true in some sense, false in some sense, meaningless in some sense, true and false in some sense, true and meaningless in some sense, false and meaningless in some sense, and true and false and meaningless in some sense.

- A public service clarification by the Sri Syadasti School of Spiritual Wisdom
Lomendil is offline  
Old 15 Dec 2005, 10:06   #10 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: On the Midnight Ocean
Posts: 26,404
Send a message via MSN to Wargamer
Default Re: Names of Armies vs Names of Soldiers

Perhaps then, we should find new ways to explain the old rules... for example, could a follower of Tzeench sacrifice himself body, mind and soul to become an entirely "warp-based" entity? If so, could he then be encased in his armour, in the same way that Warp Entities are bound to Daemon Engines?

So rather than Thousand Sons, we have Daemon-Engine Marines. The name may need work, but I think the principle is (fairly) sound... ish.
__________________
Farewell, Kangaroo Joe, you shall not be forgotten.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Norman
"Wargamer is never wrong, Frodo Baggins; he knows precisely the rules he means to."
Wargamer is offline  
Closed Thread

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Names bebe Orks 4 12 Nov 2008 18:35
NAMES! - I need them sarnas Enclave Talk 11 31 Aug 2007 11:02
Names Psyker11 Imperial Guard 11 17 Aug 2007 14:26
Names? bloodsucker General 40K 24 18 Oct 2006 22:01
Tau names shadowed_slayer Tau 3 28 Mar 2006 01:45