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Thoughts on Spearhead/Spearhead Arrival
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Old 31 May 2010, 00:25   #21 (permalink)
Shas'O
 
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Default Re: Thoughts on Spearhead/Spearhead Arrival

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unholy Harbinger
Maybe it is my mechanised Guard/Chaos/ork side of me that really loves tanks but I like spearhead.
Yep.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unholy Harbinger
Imagine 3 outflanking monoliths? but wait it gets better... see your mass attack infantry... 3 outflanking monoliths dumping 60 warriors on their doorstep and flux arcing them all.... OH YEAH!
Archeotech tech it for a more fun Arc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unholy Harbinger
I don't know about you but I really like this expansion... and to all the nay-sayers, no one is forcing you to play.
Don't get snippy when people are disappointed for the second time that an expansion has left their army worse than pretty much everyone else. Especially when this particular one has the other armies essentially stealing many of our vehicle wargear options.
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Old 31 May 2010, 11:30   #22 (permalink)
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Default Re: Thoughts on Spearhead/Spearhead Arrival

[quote=Dexter Morgan]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unholy Harbinger
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unholy Harbinger
I don't know about you but I really like this expansion... and to all the nay-sayers, no one is forcing you to play.
Don't get snippy when people are disappointed for the second time that an expansion has left their army worse than pretty much everyone else. Especially when this particular one has the other armies essentially stealing many of our vehicle wargear options.
It wasn't directed at anyone and I wans't 'getting snippy'. To be honest it isn't going to take over normal 40K. Like apocalypse peopel can whine about it all they want but in the end they don't HAVE to play it. in any expansion there will always be an army or two that won't benefit from it but is that to say no one should?

No matter how much you say it is rubbish, I like it, and as much as you say tau don't benefit... It isn't as if the team at games workshop sit around deciding which army to screw over next, and belive me I know my fairshare of not being benefited from updates and at least you don't have to play games where those disadvantages are.
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Old 31 May 2010, 17:23   #23 (permalink)
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Default Re: Thoughts on Spearhead/Spearhead Arrival

Yeah... I would have agreed had it not been for
Quote:
I know my fairshare of not being benefited from updates and at least you don't have to play games where those disadvantages are.
That's complete BS with regard to the Tau.
[hr]

On one part of your comment though (bringing up Apoc), I do not think Spearhead will be played as much as Apoc, purely for the reason that this borrows from Apoc directly (with the Apoc SH rules) and that not every army (mainly Crons, Nids, Tau, aren't as big on the "tank" aspect for what this expansion gives). You can't make the argument that the expansion doesn't favor the armies with vehicles in the mid range weapon/multiple category. Imperial treadheads will still be the best off from this and I guarantee that another Imperial boost didn't go unnoticed at GW HQ.

I do wish the NC thing was reduced to 5 though, just for the sake of the Daemons...
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Old 31 May 2010, 18:40   #24 (permalink)
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Default Re: Thoughts on Spearhead/Spearhead Arrival

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dexter Morgan
Yeah... I would have agreed had it not been for
Quote:
I know my fairshare of not being benefited from updates and at least you don't have to play games where those disadvantages are.
That's complete BS with regard to the Tau.
Hang on, are you trying to argue this is bad for the Tau?

They can have railguns with basically str11, you can use the deep strike and your skimmers and only have to scatter one of them. This for piranha squads will be brilliant, especially if your deep strike 15 off them.

I don't see them as a disadvantage.

- Will
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Old 31 May 2010, 18:45   #25 (permalink)
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Default Re: Thoughts on Spearhead/Spearhead Arrival

Personally, Tau Players should be paying more attention to the Outrider spearhead. A Hammerhead with Piranha escorts (equipped with Fusion Blasters, naturally) can not only provide major anti-tank firepower, but those Piranhas can jink in to take any hits in place of the Hammerhead, making it nigh on unkillable until they're gone!
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Old 31 May 2010, 18:51   #26 (permalink)
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Default Re: Thoughts on Spearhead/Spearhead Arrival

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fire at Will
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dexter Morgan
Yeah... I would have agreed had it not been for
Quote:
I know my fairshare of not being benefited from updates and at least you don't have to play games where those disadvantages are.
That's complete BS with regard to the Tau.
Hang on, are you trying to argue this is bad for the Tau?

They can have railguns with basically str11, you can use the deep strike and your skimmers and only have to scatter one of them. This for piranha squads will be brilliant, especially if your deep strike 15 off them.

I don't see them as a disadvantage.

- Will
I said that we are worse off in this expansion than other armies.

Those Railguns at "Strength 11" will be worse off for AT than cluster/combos of XV88's. Indeed for a Tank expansion some more thought should have been given to the other methods to counter a tank than merely another tank.

Our TL was essentially given to everyone for free, loss for us there.

The DS does not favor us any more than any other army, so I don't count that for/against us.
[hr]

Piranhas are not a horrible choice, but they are still glass cannons however you slice it. That tactic you mentioned just assures a (highly expensive) better chance at their alpha strikes.

I'm still trying to figure out if modified Stealth Hammerheads are better at the AT long term game... It will depend on how Mech'ed the opponents are I suppose. A cluster bomb vs. a sniper approach.
[hr]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wargamer
Personally, Tau Players should be paying more attention to the Outrider spearhead. A Hammerhead with Piranha escorts (equipped with Fusion Blasters, naturally) can not only provide major anti-tank firepower, but those Piranhas can jink in to take any hits in place of the Hammerhead, making it nigh on unkillable until they're gone!
I'm thinking that more players will play walkers now as well (besides Dreds), which I personally like quite a bit. I just have an unnatural affection for War Walkers and Ork walkers.
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Old 31 May 2010, 20:22   #27 (permalink)
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Default Re: Thoughts on Spearhead/Spearhead Arrival

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dexter Morgan
Yeah... I would have agreed had it not been for
Quote:
I know my fairshare of not being benefited from updates and at least you don't have to play games where those disadvantages are.
That's complete BS with regard to the Tau.
Would you care to highlight and explain?
You can play a normal game of 40K wihtout the spearhead rules avoiding all of Taus 'apparent' disadvantages. but when your army is nerfed by the core rules you have no choice... go figure. Anyway this isn't about that.

And of course this favours armies with tanks... and in regards to the medium-long range comment I disagree... just use the deepstrike spearhead if you really wan't or the outflank one (forget the names).

I think there are armies that feel much less benefit than hat tau do.
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Old 31 May 2010, 20:35   #28 (permalink)
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Default Re: Thoughts on Spearhead/Spearhead Arrival

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unholy Harbinger
Would you care to highlight and explain?
You can play a normal game of 40K wihtout the spearhead rules avoiding all of Taus 'apparent' disadvantages. but when your army is nerfed by the core rules you have no choice... go figure. Anyway this isn't about that.
I'm not sure what your trying to say here. Are you saying Tau are handicapped in normal 40k or not? I know I can play without Speahead rules, but this doesn't magically erase the inherent disadvantages of the army as-is. You seem to recognize that, but your wording on the next area is very odd and I'm not sure what your trying to say with that phrasing. ???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unholy Harbinger
And of course this favours armies with tanks... and in regards to the medium-long range comment I disagree... just use the deepstrike spearhead if you really wan't or the outflank one (forget the names).

I think there are armies that feel much less benefit than hat tau do.
Care to elaborate there? I also didn't have a Medium/Long range comment unless you meant the HH one, which was more about alternative views on what options are available that can go into the long-term plan for the game played.
[hr]

All-in-all, please try to clean up your spelling/grammar. It makes it difficult to understand you or your points. To be honest, I'm just making a go at what I thought your text said both times now. You're not a new member so this shouldn't even be an issue by now.
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Old 31 May 2010, 20:36   #29 (permalink)
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Default Re: Thoughts on Spearhead/Spearhead Arrival

For the record, Archeotech slaps a Strength 10 maximum on weapons. You can't get S11 Railguns.

Also, I agree with Unholy this is a very simple expansion, hardly a modification of the game rules, and if one feels their army is unfairly treated then they don't have to play it. I highly doubt Spearhead will be that popular a game type, at least not as popular as Battle Missions.

However, I think the idea that Tau have been completely shafted is just pessimistic. Already, tactics are being put forth, different formations able to be used to different effects. Your 4+ cover still beats a 5+ invul (from the Armoured Spearhead bonus) until the enemy closes to 12", which really shouldn't happen when you're playing lengthwise across the board. You still fire as Fast, which means at 12" movement you're firing 2 main and all defensive! Outrider? Skyfall? Certainly effective Spearheads for Tau skimmers!

To say that Tau are in a bad situation in general is fine, and I agree - they really need a 5th ed update. But to say that Spearhead is particularly horrible for Tau strikes me as simply being unimaginative. You can now pack in an ungodly amount of Railguns and protect them with a variety of new rules to make Leman Russ columns quake in fear.
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Old 31 May 2010, 20:44   #30 (permalink)
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Default Re: Thoughts on Spearhead/Spearhead Arrival

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chapter Master Seth
For the record, Archeotech slaps a Strength 10 maximum on weapons. You can't get S11 Railguns.
Does the tank hunter special rule have no effect on str10 weapons then?

Because that was what I was talking about, hammerheads with tank hunter USR.

- Will
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