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[Apoc] Help me, need starting
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Old 14 Jan 2010, 16:22   #1 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default [Apoc] Help me, need starting

Hey guys my Ork army is expanding so rapidly it could be going towards an Apocalypse-Sized Game so if anyone has anything to help me out on what to get, that will be great.

Stompas or what? ive had a quick glance at Apocalypse book and thats about it so I will not be very familar with this, I've heard of Fightabommas but never seen them so i'm quite interested in them aswell.

help me join in the great wars of Apocalypse, it seems like madness for battles, espeically judging by the size of the templates that are used.
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Old 14 Jan 2010, 16:27   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: [Apoc] Help me, need starting

A lot of the Apocalypse specific unit were initially from Forge World so a quick look there might help.
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Old 14 Jan 2010, 16:41   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: [Apoc] Help me, need starting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boneguard
A lot of the Apocalypse specific unit were initially from Forge World so a quick look there might help.
Wow, some nice stuff there but would help knowing points cost and I supoise I would need the imperial armour books thingy they have?

Some things are mega expensive, a Mega-Gargant for £220? No thanks!

You got any ideas on what I should get? All I keep thinking is either Stompa or Fighter-Bomma
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Old 14 Jan 2010, 21:58   #4 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: [Apoc] Help me, need starting

where did you find the mega gargant???

And check the Battlefortresses, they look cool and have cool rules, being very versatile and with a grot bomb launcha, excellent against almost anything.
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Old 14 Jan 2010, 22:16   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: [Apoc] Help me, need starting

Forge World does not produce a Gargant, Mega or otherwise. The closest thing they have is the Mega Dread.

Perhaps you were referring to the Gargantuan Squiggoth?
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Old 14 Jan 2010, 22:32   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: [Apoc] Help me, need starting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasonsea212
You got any ideas on what I should get? All I keep thinking is either Stompa or Fighter-Bomma
Sorry, I don't do ork, so I wouldn,t be able to help you there, aside from provideing you with a link to fighta-bomba.

Stompa or regular squiggoth spam could be funny to see.
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Old 15 Jan 2010, 12:28   #7 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: [Apoc] Help me, need starting

So no help?

I feel the urge to reach for stompa just because its big and I know I can buy it instantly, its been sitting in the shop for a few months now ;D

And yeah, It is a Gargantuan Squiggoth, I got kind of mixed up :-\

Battlefortress look kind of a big Wagon, sorry it just doesen't feel right and it is £190 so that is gonna steer me way off, max ill pay for something for now is £60, need rest for Apoc book and Templates...
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Old 16 Jan 2010, 00:56   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: [Apoc] Help me, need starting

So, you're looking to take the green horde to apocalyptic levels? Sounds good, but you really need to have a plan. Buying things willy-nilly will result in problems further down the line so we need to sit down and have a good think about things before laying any money on the table.

The main thing to bring to your attention is the horde of new units that you can take in Apocalypse that are available outside of the standard Ork codex. We'll have a look at these in a moment. First of all, lets introduce you to some terminology since you don't have the Apocalypse rulebook yet.

There are two type of new things that you can take; Legendary Units and Battle Formations (known collectively as Datasheets). Legendary Units are individual units that are either considered too powerful for regular gameplay or are available from Forgeworld. Battle Formations are groupings of existing units (and sometimes some Legendary Units) that represent larger contingents of units. For example, in an Imperial Guard army, a Baneblade would be a Legendary Unit whilst an 'Emperor's Fist' Armoured Company (of 10 Leman Russes) would be a Battle Formation.

In the case of Legendary Units, the name itself will be a link to where you can either purchase the model or a recommended model to convert into this unit.

[box][table][tr][td][acronym=Legendary Unit]LU[/acronym]/[acronym=Battle Formation]BF[/acronym]?[/td][td]Name[/td][td]Location[/td][td]Rough overview and notes[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Stompa[/td][td]Apocalypse[/td][td]Super-Heavy Walker that is a great centrepiece for any Ork Apocalypse army[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Big Mek's Stompa[/td][td]Apocalypse[/td][td]Stompa variant that focusses more on ranged attacks than melee[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Fighta-Bommer[/td][td]Apocalypse[/td][td]Good all-round Ork Flyer capable of attacking ground or airborne targets[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Skullhammer Battle Fortress[/td][td]Apocalypse[/td][td]Fast Super-Heavy Tank that both shoots and transports Boyz[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Gargantuan Squiggoth[/td][td]Apocalypse[/td][td]Gargantuan Creature that makes a fantastic alternative to the Stompa as a centrepiece of your army[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Battle Formation[/td][td]Kult of Speed[/td][td]Apocalypse[/td][td]Warboss (on Bike or in a Trukk) leads other fast units across the battlefield and back with a huge emphasis on speed[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Battle Formation[/td][td]Dred Mob[/td][td]Apocalypse[/td][td]Stompas, Deff Dreads and Killa Kans all grouped together to take advantage of a built-in Kustom Force Field[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Goff Klawstompa[/td][td]Apocalypse Reload[/td][td]Stompa variant focussing almost exclusively on melee attacks[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Battle Formation[/td][td]Ghazghkull's Bully Boyz[/td][td]Apocalypse Reload[/td][td]Ghazghkull Thraka gathers his nastiest and most fearless Nobz together whilst Ork spacecraft drop asteroids on their enemies' heads[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Battle Formation[/td][td]Deffkopta (Big) Choppa Skwadron[/td][td]Apocalypse Reload[/td][td]6+ Deffkoptas speed across the battlefield, causing chaos by using their 'Kopta Blades as melee weapons as well as dropping bonus bombs (Big Choppa Skwadron (12+ Deffkoptas) only)[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Battle Formation[/td][td]Loota Wreckin' Krew[/td][td]Apocalypse Reload[/td][td]Trukk-mounted Lootas and (Big) Meks speed across the battlefield to claim the wrecks of enemy Super-Heavies as additional objectives[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Battle Formation[/td][td]Da Green Tide[/td][td]Apocalypse Reload [sup]*1*[/sup][/td][td]A Warboss leads a hundred or more Boyz in a single unit that surges across the battlefield slaughtering everything in its way[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Ork Flakkatrakk [sup]*2*[/sup][/td][td]Apocalypse Reload[/td][td]An anti-aircraft vehicle that is uniquely Orky[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Ork Pulsa Rokkit [sup]*3*[/sup][/td][td]Apocalypse Reload [sup]*1*[/sup][/td][td]An immobile structure built around launching a massive, one-shot rokkit that can potentially immobilise a portion of the enemy army[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Big Squiggoth[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse[/td][td]Smaller version of the Gargantuan Squggoth that can still take a hefty bite out of any opposition[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Gun Wagon[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse[/td][td]A slower, more heavily armed and armoured Trukk, available with an Armoured Top, Zzap Gun, Kannon, or Big Shootas[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]'Krusha' Battle Wagon[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse[/td][td]Stripped down version of the 'Dethrolla' Battle Fortress below, and can be considered approximately equivalent to a regular Battlewagon[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]'Dethrolla' Battle Fortress[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse[/td][td]Slow, but tough, the Battle Fortress is armed to the teeth with guns but doesn't bring anything particularly special to an Apocalypse game[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Fighta[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse[/td][td]Cheap Flyer specialising in ground attack[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Looted Rhino[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse[/td][td]A looted Rhino, that would generally be better represented with the regular Looted Wagon entry from Codex: Orks[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Battle Formation[/td][td]Tanka Mob[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse[/td][td]3-10 vehicles group together to ignore certain damage results[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Battle Formation[/td][td]Squiggoth Battle Herd[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse[/td][td]3 or more Squiggoths, of any size, band together and go on a rampage through the enemy army[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Grot Bomm Launcha[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse[/td][td]One-shot guided missile (guided by a Grot riding INSIDE said missile) shot from the back of a Warbuggy[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Battle Formation[/td][td]Trukk Konvoy[/td][td]Games Workshop Website[/td][td]3+ Trukks group together to speed across the battlefield even faster than normal[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Ork Minelayer [sup]*4*[/sup][/td][td]Games Workshop Website[/td][td]Super-Heavy Skimmer that drops mines as it moves across the battlefield[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Battle Formation[/td][td]Shokk Attack Battery[/td][td]Games Workshop Website[/td][td]3+ Big Meks armed with Shokk Attack Guns, accompanied by a horde of Snotlings, combine their firepower to give random, but potentially devastating, results[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Ork Submersible [sup]*5*[/sup][/td][td]Games Workshop Website[/td][td]An Ork Submarine, originally detailed in Liber Apocalyptica, that transports a large amount of Orks to the battlefield (assuming you've got a water feature large enough to contain it)[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Evil Eye In Da Sky[/td][td]Games Workshop Website[/td][td]Stompa variant that acts as an aircraft carrier for Deff Koptas[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Ork Mega-Dread[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse 2[/td][td]Larger and tougher version of a Deff Dread[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Unknown[/td][td]Ork Mekboy Junka[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse 2[/td][td]I do not know anything about this unit yet as I do not own a copy of IAA2 yet[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Ork Big Trakk[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse 2[/td][td]A Trukk that is slower but more heavily armed and armoured and more capable of moving over rough ground[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Unknown[/td][td]Ork 'Kustom' Battle Fortress[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse 2[/td][td]I do not know anything about this unit yet as I do not own a copy of IAA2 yet[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Legendary Unit[/td][td]Ork Kill Krusha 'Eavy Tank[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse 2[/td][td]Massive and speedy but slightly unreliable Super-Heavy with a variable firing main weapon[/td][/tr]
[tr][td]Unknown[/td][td]Ork Mega-Rippa Krew[/td][td]Imperial Armour Apocalypse 2[/td][td]I do not know anything about this unit yet as I do not own a copy of IAA2 yet[/td][/tr]
[/table]

Notes

*1* These datasheets were originally available for download from the Games Workshop website (and still are). However, the version located in the location noted is the most recent version of the Datasheet and should be used over the older, downloadable version.

*2* The Ork Flakkatrakk isn't really based around any given existing kit. The picture given in the book seems to combine parts from a Trukk, a Battlewagon, and a Stompa, as well as numerous other Orky bits and plasticard sheets and tubes.

*3* The Pulsa Rokkit isn't really based around any existing kit. You'll likely need to scratchbuild this yourself using insulation foamboard, plasticard struts, Orky bits, and something akin to a rather large rocket. Also, this is FAR bigger than the old Pulsa Rokkit from Second Edition so don't even think of using that as a stand-in.

*4* The Ork Minelayer isn't really based around any existing kit. In fact, it's pretty much an entirely scratch built model. If you want one you'll have to look further afield than Games Workshop's products to make this one.

*5* Like the Ork Minelayer, the Submersible is pretty much an entire scratchbuild project.[/box]
In addition to the above listed Datasheets, bear in mind that Forgeworld is gearing up for Imperial Armour 8, known to include several of the newer Ork units they've released as well as new Special Characters (such as Mek Boss Buzzgob) so keep an eye out for that when it gets released.

The other thing you can do in Apocalypse, that you can't normally do in regular Warhammer 40,000, is take more units in any given Force Organisation slot than you normally can. There are no limits to what you take in Apocalypse, so if you want to take 10 Elite choices you can. In addition, any 0-1 or Unique limits do not apply so you could, if you wished, take multiple copies of the same Special Character (though you'll probably get a few odd glances if you do considering that they are supposed to represent specific individuals in the Warhammer 40,000 universe).


I hope this post helps you, and if you have any further questions about this topic then please feel free to respond here


Get this man a cookie. Oh wait I can do just that! +1 for you! Fish Ead
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Old 18 Jan 2010, 12:42   #9 (permalink)
Shas'La
 
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Default Re: [Apoc] Help me, need starting

I must say Masked, Wow, You must of spent loads of time writing this up for me, Thanks for all of this!

A few things though,

You say a plan is needed, what sort of plan? I will be getting Apocalypse book in about a weeks time so I should have had time to look it through before i have my budget (around £100-£200)

will I need both the Apocalypse and Reload book for these rules?

Also I like the battle formation rules, I could mount around 300 boyz in one squad with a warboss? Nice! (How come i've never heard or seen one but there we go.)

Imperial Armour? Is that some kind of goffy book you get from some website full of stuff made up for you?

Just also wanna know can you make your own rules and model for a Legendary unit?

Thanks for doing all of this, you defintly deserved that +1, must of taken you so long!
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Old 18 Jan 2010, 13:36   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: [Apoc] Help me, need starting

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasonsea212
I must say Masked, Wow, You must of spent loads of time writing this up for me, Thanks for all of this!
You're quite welcome . And call me MT.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasonsea212
You say a plan is needed, what sort of plan? I will be getting Apocalypse book in about a weeks time so I should have had time to look it through before i have my budget (around £100-£200)
Well, it really depends on you. I suppose the main thing to do would be to look at your existing model collection and decide whether you wanted your additional purchases to match what you already do or to complement them instead. For example, if you had a shooty army, which had loads of Lootas in it, then to match your existing army you'd want to purchase lots of shooty things and to complement your army you'd purchase fast, tough and/or close combat based things.

Your plan should, therefore, consist of a listing of your existing models, how you normally use them, how you wish to expand your army in Apocalypse, and finally a list of models that will allow you to accomplish this. Considering you don't have any of the Apocalypse books already, I'm willing to do this last step for you. So if you could post here with a list of your existing models, how you use them, and whether you want to match or complement them then I'll be able to help you further. Telling me your expected budget may help too, since that's a restriction I'll have to work within.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasonsea212
will I need both the Apocalypse and Reload book for these rules?
All of the core Apocalypse rules are contained in the core Apocalypse expansion book. In the above list, I have noted the locations of each Datasheet according to which book they are located in. So, if you wanted to use a Skullhammer Battle Fortress then you'd already have it since you are planning on buying the Apocalypse book anyway. However, if you wanted to use Ghazghkull's Bully Boyz then you would need to purchase Apocalypse Reload. There is no real need to purchase any of the books other than the core Apocalypse expansion book, other than to increase the number of Datasheets (and Strategic Assets) available to you. So, if you don't think you'll need any of the Datasheets listed in any given book, you don't need to buy the book. Obviously, the Datasheets listed on the GW website are available to download for free.

For reference, you can read about and/or purchase each of the books listed here:

Apocalypse
Apocalypse Reload
Imperial Armour Apocalypse
Imperial Armour Apocalypse 2


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasonsea212
Also I like the battle formation rules, I could mount around 300 boyz in one squad with a warboss? Nice! (How come i've never heard or seen one but there we go.)
Da Green Tide, as a Datasheet, is ONLY available for use in Apocalypse games, so if you've not played alongside (or against) another Ork player in Apocalypse then I'm not too surprised that you've never heard of it before (not to mention that not every Ork player has enough Boyz to actually field a Green Tide).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasonsea212
Imperial Armour? Is that some kind of goffy book you get from some website full of stuff made up for you?
Imperial Armour is the name of the book series that Forgeworld produces. It contains rules for each of the units they produce (excluding those for which they've only recently released) as well as oodles of background information on said units. Initially compilations of the rules they'd previously released via the Citadel Journal, they took the decision to start making 'campaign' books, in so much as each book released since Imperial Armour Volume 3 has been a detailed description of a particular campaign of war undertaken in the 40k universe. They read very much like history books, but obviously for a fictional, future history, as well as having technical diagrams and the rules for the new units.

I, for one, don't consider Forgeworld's products or rules goofy. Considering that Forgeworld operates under the Games Workshop umbrella, they are about as official as you can get, outside of the main studio itself.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasonsea212
Just also wanna know can you make your own rules and model for a Legendary unit?
You can. It is even encouraged to some degree, as long as you don't go overboard and make up things for the sake of winning the game rather than improving the story. You can find a guide on how to do so here. That article details some of the thought process that you ought to go through when you do so. If you get around to making your own, then feel free to post them in the Expansions board where you will get feedback on all aspects of your newly created Datasheet.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasonsea212
Thanks for doing all of this, you defintly deserved that +1, must of taken you so long!
Honestly, it's no problem at all. I'm actually moving in about 10 days time, and I'll be forced to leave all my books behind, so in the future I won't really be able to help people as much as I can now. And I like to help out where I can
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