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1500 Ulthwe army
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Old 20 Jul 2005, 18:43   #1 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default 1500 Ulthwe army

I am increasingly considering the possibility of changing from an Alaitoc ranger force to an Ulthwe force.* What do you think:

HQ
Seer Council:
Farseer with singing spear, ROW, Eldritch Storm and Fortune
Farseer with shuriken pistol, cc weapon, ROW and fortune
Warlock with s.p, cc weapon, ROW and augment
Warlock with s.p, cc weapon, ROW and augment
Warlock with s.p, cc weapon and destructor

Elites
Striking scorpions x 5 (with haywire grenades)
Exarch with scorpions claw and stealth

Fire Dragons x 10
Exarch with firepike and tank hunter.
Wave serpent with bright lances, shuriken cannon and spirit stone.

Troops
Black guardian defenders x 16
Warlock with cc weapon, s.p and conceal
Starcannon

Black guardian defenders x 16
Warlock with cc weapon, s.p and conceal
Starcannon

Fast attack
Guardian jetbikes x 5
Warlock with shuriken cannon and destructor

Heavy support
Wraithlord with EMS


Tactics
The black guardians form a solid strong fighting core, capable of holding objectives and giving massed, lethal firepower at short range.* The starcannons also enable them to take out nastier units.* My jetbiked guardians I use for hit and run attacks at essential targets.* They outflank, harass and confuse the enemy and get very nasty with the warlock's destructor and shuriken cannon!

My cc squad - scorpions infiltrate into a good position.* From there they speedily make it to the enemy's lines and cause assault mayhem, especially with the exarch's scorpion claw.
My Fire dragons, in the wave serpent, speedily make it down the field like the scorpions (but just in a different way) and cause destruction where they're needed.* They can blow up tanks - and so can the wave serpent.* It also has the shuriken cannon, which combined with the BL, can also take out infantry.

My seer council has eldritch storm to take out enemy infantry at long range (thank you augment!)* It also has fortune to use on itself to ensure that it soaks up as much firepower as possible.* For the first turn or so both farseers will use fortune (one probably going to a guardian squad or perhaps the scorpions) to ensure that my units survive the long trudge to the front lines where they can do damage.* The singing spear can be a light tank killer and will also increase the nastiness of the seer council in cc.

The wraithlord is wreak devastation in cc but before that will use the EMS to either tank hunt, or to fry infantry.*

What do you think?
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Old 20 Jul 2005, 19:09   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: 1500 Ulthwe army

Nice list on the whole, however to make it legal drop the holofields on that wave serpent! I am a big fan of the scorps, so I would bump their numbers up above 5. Even with that nasty claw ont he exarch they can still get bogged down, and with toughness 3, even if they win combat each round they will get worn down and broken quickly.

What is the real purpose of the seer council though? I take it they will have to stick by either the wraithlord or the black gaurdians to guide them? I tend to prefer slightly larger councils with a more specific battlefield role, and with a witchblade or two in there! But anyway its your list and it is very solid, just change that one thing.

--42
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Old 20 Jul 2005, 19:52   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: 1500 Ulthwe army

Quote:
Originally Posted by 42
Nice list on the whole, however to make it legal drop the holofields on that wave serpent! I am a big fan of the scorps, so I would bump their numbers up above 5. Even with that nasty claw ont he exarch they can still get bogged down, and with toughness 3, even if they win combat each round they will get worn down and broken quickly.

What is the real purpose of the seer council though? I take it they will have to stick by either the wraithlord or the black gaurdians to guide them? I tend to prefer slightly larger councils with a more specific battlefield role, and with a witchblade or two in there! But anyway its your list and it is very solid, just change that one thing.

--42
Oops, deholifying now....

About the Seer council - I do have a plan for them but since you're going to be one of the main people I'll be playing forgive me when I say, 'I'm not going to tell you!'
Thanks for the compliment by the way. ;D
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Old 20 Jul 2005, 19:53   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: 1500 Ulthwe army

Thats fine, it would take the fun out of battling if I knew exactly what you were going to do so consider yourself forgiven! (besides I want to concentrate on fantasy anyway now!).

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Old 20 Jul 2005, 20:54   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: 1500 Ulthwe army

I would also make the Seer Council a little bigger, perhaps 1 more Farseer and 1 or 2 Warlocks.

I'd drop Destructer and Eldritch Storm from the Council, give all the Farseers Witchblades or Singing Speers. I don't think Eldritch Storm is worth it and you will be mostly using Fortune. You won't need Destructer when you have that Many Shuri.Cats nearby.

I'd give your Council Warlocks Ehance and Embolden also, that will make them much better in CC and you don't want a squad that is so expensive getting wiped out if they get run from an assault.

I'm not sure what you could drop to make those changes, if you want to make them that is.
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Old 21 Jul 2005, 03:39   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: 1500 Ulthwe army

almost all advice given on these boards (occasionally by your good self also) is that jetbikes are generally a bit of a waste of points.. i'm unsure why you've gone in for them, but i'd consider dropping them for a couple of those beloved vypers (starcannoned/EML/bright lance).

elrich storm isn't the most reliable attack, an augmented mind war is the most accurate and arguably the most deadly ranged attack that the eldar have, it's professional sniping to say the least (although occasionally somewhat unreliable for damage).

you could also consider throwing in a cheap warlock or two (warlock, augment, cc, sp) to take wounds in place of the "main" council members.
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Old 21 Jul 2005, 06:01   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: 1500 Ulthwe army

Well, the army is geared up to mainly fight Tau. That's why I have Eldritch Storm - for the weak toughnessd fire warriors and that's also why I'm not considering taking vypers - vypers with their weak armour are just a points sink against the anti tank Tau - and usually when we play there isn't enough cover to take advantage of the CTM upgrade...
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Old 21 Jul 2005, 12:40   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: 1500 Ulthwe army

I think Eldritch Storm against Tau is a bad idea, for that many points you will be wounding on a 4+ and they will still get their very decent armour save. Say you get 4 under the template, you will kill 1, Is it really worth it?.

With that many S5 shots coming your way the Council won't stand upto much unless it is filled out a little.

As you are playing against Tau I'd definatley increase the Council as you will no doubt wan't to advance on them.

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Old 22 Jul 2005, 20:24   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: 1500 Ulthwe army

Here's what I'd suggest. Bear in mind I haven't worked out exact points costs!

HQ
Seer Council:
Farseer with Singing Spear, ROW, Fortune
Farseer with Shuriken Pistol, cc weapon, ROW and Fortune
Warlock with s.p, cc weapon, ROW and Augment
Warlock with s.p, cc weapon, ROW and Augment
Warlock with s.p, Witchblade and Enhance
Warlock with s.p, cc weapon and Embolden

Elites
Striking scorpions x 5 (with haywire grenades)
Exarch with Scorpions claw and Stealth

Fire Dragons x 10
Exarch with Firepike and tank Hunter.
Wave serpent with Bright Lances, Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stone.

Troops
Black Guardian Defenders x 16
Warlock with cc weapon, s.p and conceal
Starcannon

Black Guardian Defenders x 16
Warlock with cc weapon, s.p and conceal
Starcannon

Fast Attack
Swooping Hawks x5
Exarch with Power Weapon and Sustained Assault

Heavy Support
Wraithlord with EML

----------------------------------
I'd beef up the SC a bit by adding a Warlock with Embolden (it can help, especially in combat ot taking lots of casulties from Fire Warrior teams). I've also got rid of Destructor and given that Warlock Enhance (making the SC very deadly) and a Witch Blade.

I'm not too keen on Jetbikes and against the Tau they aren't likely to survive for long, so I've replaced them with a Swooping Hawks Exarch delivery unit. If you can get that guy stuck into their lines you're going to do a lot of damage, and the blast template along with the las-shots will help whittle down his lines even more. The added bonus of course is that tying up Fire Warriors in combat can reduce the amount of firepower coming your way quite considerably!

If you can spare the points you might want to get a Falcon to transport your Seer Council, but you might need to make a few consessions (I.e. get rid of those Star Cannons!). People tend to respect your win more if you don't use Star Cannons. Also bear in mind that if you get rid of the Sar Cannons, those Guardians can close in on the Tau a lot quicker!

Hope that helps. 8)
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Old 23 Jul 2005, 10:12   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: 1500 Ulthwe army

Quote:
Originally Posted by Farseer Restayvien
Here's what I'd suggest. Bear in mind I haven't worked out exact points costs!

HQ
Seer Council:
Farseer with Singing Spear, ROW, Fortune
Farseer with Shuriken Pistol, cc weapon, ROW and Fortune
Warlock with s.p, cc weapon, ROW and Augment
Warlock with s.p, cc weapon, ROW and Augment
Warlock with s.p, Witchblade and Enhance
Warlock with s.p, cc weapon and Embolden

Elites
Striking scorpions x 5 (with haywire grenades)
Exarch with Scorpions claw and Stealth

Fire Dragons x 10
Exarch with Firepike and tank Hunter.
Wave serpent with Bright Lances, Shuriken Cannon and Spirit Stone.

Troops
Black Guardian Defenders x 16
Warlock with cc weapon, s.p and conceal
Starcannon

Black Guardian Defenders x 16
Warlock with cc weapon, s.p and conceal
Starcannon

Fast Attack
Swooping Hawks x5
Exarch with Power Weapon and Sustained Assault

Heavy Support
Wraithlord with EML

----------------------------------
I'd beef up the SC a bit by adding a Warlock with Embolden (it can help, especially in combat ot taking lots of casulties from Fire Warrior teams). I've also got rid of Destructor and given that Warlock Enhance (making the SC very deadly) and a Witch Blade.

I'm not too keen on Jetbikes and against the Tau they aren't likely to survive for long, so I've replaced them with a Swooping Hawks Exarch delivery unit. If you can get that guy stuck into their lines you're going to do a lot of damage, and the blast template along with the las-shots will help whittle down his lines even more. The added bonus of course is that tying up Fire Warriors in combat can reduce the amount of firepower coming your way quite considerably!

If you can spare the points you might want to get a Falcon to transport your Seer Council, but you might need to make a few consessions (I.e. get rid of those Star Cannons!). People tend to respect your win more if you don't use Star Cannons. Also bear in mind that if you get rid of the Sar Cannons, those Guardians can close in on the Tau a lot quicker!

Hope that helps.* 8)
Thanks. That's given me lots of things to think about.

What's wrong with having two starcannons? It's not as if I've given my wave serpent and wraithlord starcannons. I want something geared towards taking out tough units - and GW have given us this fantastic weapon...
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