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Advice for a friend
Old 29 Jul 2009, 14:42   #1 (permalink)
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Default Advice for a friend

I got a call from an Eldar playing friend last night; it seems that he has been challenged to a match by one of our buddies that plays Chaos Marines. The problem is he has never seen Chaos in action much less played them in a game. So he wanted to know what to expect and what I would suggest.

The game is in the 2000-2500 point range so I told him to expect twin lash princes, 30 berserkers with transports, a vindi or two, plus what ever else he can fit in at that point range (the Chaos player’s typical MO). Unfortunately I don’t play Eldar so I couldn’t tell him what works best against this kind of list, just what the strengths of the Chaos units were. Do any of you guys have any experience/advice I could pass along so he doesn’t get chewed?
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Old 29 Jul 2009, 14:56   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Advice for a friend

He will need high strength weapon, becasue I'm willing to bet good money he will be facing a land raider. So he need to be able to hit AV 14 vehicule. So probably Fire Dragon in a transport.

Howling Banshee and Dark reaper can also help since they are pretty descent vs MEQ. Scorpion can also do well too, especially versus large group. This little tactica could help him a bit.

Aside from that, if his opponent goes Twin lash, they he will need mobility to counter him as much as possible and avoid getting mowed down.

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Old 29 Jul 2009, 15:13   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Advice for a friend

[list type=decimal][*]Don't die.[*]Have a good time, regardless of who wins.[/list][hr]Does this Chaos player really play with 30 Berserkers, two Vindi's and two Lash Princes? If so, why bother playing him at all? Seriously. I tend to play rather monotonous lists because I typically can't afford to have a 4,000 point pool of miniatures to play versatile lists. However, the Lash Prince list is so old and boring by now...it completely lacks any originality or thought on the part of the player.

That said, here's what I'd suggest:

Farseer with Runes of Warding - This is going to be essential to breaking the lash list. Throwing three dice is going to make them a lot more inefficient. The Farseer power is really up to him. Preferably, it should be something that is support oriented since he really doesn't want to lose his Farseer. Mind War is an option as it can ace those Berserker Champions.

Fire Dragons - at least one minimized unit without an Exarch. Maybe two (if he has two Falcons, esp). These will hunt DP's and Vindicators (possibly even Oblits). The low model count of his list will make these guys all the more potent.

Falcons - one for each unit of Dragons. Preferably with a Starcannon. But an EML would be decent as well. The Falcons will hunt Rhinos or Berserkers while they take the Dragons forward.

Dire Avengers - with Dual Cats and Bladestorm. They are cheap, expendable, and scoring. Having a 24" threat range means that Lash and Vindies will be less efficient against them and you can take down infantry pretty well with these guys.

Vypers / War Walkers - both are fast, shooty vehicles. That means they can avoid Lash and still kill things. They're both really cheap as well. So you can throw them away.
[hr]I wouldn't worry too much about the Berserkers at first. Taking down those Princes and Vindies should be the priority. Defilers could be an issue as well. I'd take a Defliler before I'd take a Vindicator in this list. Of course, Oblits are always a concern. They tend to die more easily due to Fire Dragons, though.

Your friend will need to utilize all of our tricks to win this. He needs to be faster and more flexible than the Chaos player. He also has to keep a few throw away units around so that he can play fast and loose against the smaller Chaos force. Being able to throw a unit of Guardian Jetbikes in front of some Berserkers can buy you time to set up shooting or redeploy more vital assets.

Numbers are really the #1 weakness of the Dual Lash list. They just simply tend to not have the bodies to allow them to overcome armies that can afford to throw units away. That's why I'm undefeated with my Orks against it.

The #2 weakness with Dual Lash is that it's terribly predictable. After deployment, the cycle becomes almost redundant. "Oh, now your lashing me towards your vindicators? How novel!" In this way, it can be consistantly countered.

Hope this helps,
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Old 29 Jul 2009, 15:41   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Advice for a friend

Yep, he really plays 30 Berserkers, two Vindis and two Lash Princes on a regular basis. He does also own a couple of Defilers and about 6 Oblits so I wouldn’t be surprised to see them on the field.

I told Jon (the Eldar player) that he would probably be best shooting the Vindis and transports first, then taking on the princes. I figured that it would take a while to drop the princes so save them for later. I hadn’t even thought about attacking them with Fire Dragons.
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Old 29 Jul 2009, 17:29   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Advice for a friend

a squad of fire dragons with a wave serpent that has bright lances should take down any tanks you encounter, and from looking at the codex, 3 war walkers armed with dual starcannons should wipe out marines and terminators. if their all berzerkers, a full squad of banshees or 2 should cut them up. make sure all units are in transports, cause anything other than banshees are gonna die in combat, so get as mobile as possible. all other wave serpents should have bright lances as well in case the dragons die. also, the dragons can take out any terminators they face with their fusion guns as well, so bear that in mind.
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Old 29 Jul 2009, 18:09   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Advice for a friend

The absolute necessity is to bring some Runes Of Warding on a Farseer. That Lash power is one of the nastiest things in the game. I like Mind War as a Farseer power when I am fighting armies that feature high point models with extreme super powers. Its so easy to just make the Demon Prince or uber-sorceror's head explode with a roughly 50% chance of success every time you try. Beyond that it can take out Sergeants (champions, whatever...) and heavy weapons troops, hiding behind their squads, and whatever else other than vehicles. In a game that big, he might want to consider using Eldrad instead off a regular Farseer. Eldrad is the ultimate weapon against chaos because he comes with the runes already, he is tough, hits hard (but not often), and uses 3 powers per turn with access to all of them. Eldrad is versatile.
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