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Whats Wrong With The Eldar?
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Old 01 Apr 2005, 22:16   #1 (permalink)
Shas'El
 
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Default Whats Wrong With The Eldar?

Pointy ears and high pitched laughing aside, some things about the current Eldar codex are just wrong. Some things we have seen:
Dark reapers and Swooping Hawks. Same armour values, but they don't look like it!
Shuircat range, no use compared to the bolter?
Why don't Storm Squads have a better save if they're going into the thick of it?

What else needs addressing in the new codex?
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Old 01 Apr 2005, 22:29   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Whats Wrong With The Eldar?

Hmm, I think the Avatar has been provebially beaten to death.

How about Warp-Spiders weapons? There was quite a bit of 'controversy' surrounding those.
Also, I wish Guardians were more...interesting (e.g. more upgrades).
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Old 02 Apr 2005, 12:12   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Whats Wrong With The Eldar?

Basically...

I want an UPGRADE available for the Shuricat.
Boost the Warp Spider weaponry
Improved reaper save
reduction in points cost for the War Walkers
A better avatar
non-farseer HQ (Which, I am told, we are getting, the Aurtach or soemthing... :-[)
More gaurdian upgrades
Cheaper Jetbikes
limit on Wraithlords
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Old 02 Apr 2005, 12:51   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Whats Wrong With The Eldar?

The Eldar are a great race but I think that the codex is simply out of date. It is out of date for three reasons:

Tau
upgraded Space Marines
The new 4th edition rules

The biggest 'offender' is the new 4th edition rules. The Eldar have been quite simply put at a bigger disadvantage than they were in the 3rd edition. To understand my view (this sounds horribly like a school essay!) lets look at the Eldar natural strengths and weaknesses.

Strengths - excellent weapons, powerful psykers, relitavely fast army
Weaknesses - fragile, very short ranged weaponry.

Eldar have great weapons, but they are usually very short ranged. Therefore the Eldar must be used in a certain way - they must use their speed (either fleet of foot/jetbikes/transports) to get up close with the enemy. However the new rules have made this more difficult. The rule that half the units may fire from a transport has gone, replaced with 'fire points' rule. The new access points rule also makes it difficult to manoeuveure your units correctly. You now can't assault the turn when you disembark making it very easy to leave your precious howling banshees in plain view for a turn - ensuring that they get shot up and killed very easily. Now also units have to assault the unit they shoot at, which can make things very difficult for the Eldar as they rely on a fine mix of firepower and cc to ensure maximum effect. Gone are the days when a squad of fire dragons could shoot at space marines before sweeping into a tank and blowing it up with melta bombs.

I'm not saying that these rule changes are bad or illogical, they just ensure that the Eldar need upgrades.

The Tau are the one army which makes life very difficult for the Eldar. Especially fire warriors. They have a range which is over twice as big as many of the Eldar's normal infantry weapons and the high strength and sheer volume of fire ensure that they can kill anything infantry based in the Eldar army. The only weapons which can outrange them are heavy weapons - starcannons/EMS/scatter lasers etc but you don't want to be wasting them on normal troops. They should be reserved for much more tough units.

The Space marines are not so great offenders but GW has given them great weapons and a huge armoury section full of upgrades which can ensure that they can easily be killed - as their weapons can easily outrange the Eldar's weapons.
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Old 02 Apr 2005, 13:50   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Whats Wrong With The Eldar?

the 'fire points' rule on transports has not been changed, you have never been able to fire out of a wave serpent as it has never had any firepoints.

As for the tau, it all depends on the type of eldar force you are playing, i do agree that the superior range of their guns is a big advantage, but against a fast saim hann force or simly an eldar force with a little bit of speed and a good commander, this can be combatted. With eldar they have an absolutly huge oppoerutnity to stuff armies full of weapons such as the star cannon, bright lance, EML etc. much more than other armies, especially in vyper squadrons or war walker squadrons.

The sheer amount of eldar weapons which are ap 3or better means that they have a huge natural advantage over space marines as well so i wouldnt worry too much about them. They do have a nasty armoury (check out the chaos one if you think theirs is bad!) but eldar are probably the best way of combatting them anyway!

--42

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Old 02 Apr 2005, 14:23   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Whats Wrong With The Eldar?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 42
the 'fire points' rule on transports has not been changed, you have never been able to fire out of a wave serpent as it has never had any firepoints.
In the third edition there was a rule stating that half the units being transported in vehicles could fire out of them. However in the fourth edition a new rule has come in about fire points and saying that vehicles must have firepoints in order to allow units to fire out of them (unless they're open topped.) Of course, since Space Marines are the only army to have been upgraded recently atm they have the only tanks with fire points
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Old 02 Apr 2005, 14:28   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Whats Wrong With The Eldar?

nope,

fire points are mentioned in third ed codex's, in the tau codex it specifically says that the devilfish has no fire points as it is a pressurized environment.

Also in the chaos space marine codex (3rd ed. release too) under the rhino section it specifies that there are fire points where two marines may fire from.

The wave serpent has no fire points so half of the crew may never fire out. The fire dragons would just blow up their own wave serpent with their fusion guns! well its would certainly save me the bother! So this rule hasnt affected eldar in any way, the real difference in transports is that you can no longer rhino rush, in fact you may only assult out of a transport if it is open topped (which co-incidentaly means its has fire points for all the troops) or stationary.

Hope that helps clear things up!
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Old 02 Apr 2005, 14:30   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Whats Wrong With The Eldar?

I'll take your word about the codexs, I only have the Eldar codex but as far as I've known, I knew nothing about the fire points rule until 4th edition came out and I've always abided by the rules in the third edition rulebook - half the units inside may fire.
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Old 02 Apr 2005, 14:35   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Whats Wrong With The Eldar?

that may be the rules for open topped vehicles but certainly not an eldar waveserpent. IF you think about it then just where can (potentially) 5 fire dragons fire their fusion guns outs of! As in the eldar codex the wave serpent has never been a) equipped with fire points, or b) open topped then no passangers can fire out of it. Although there never used to be a wave serpent model the codex descriptions on vehicles are very clear to say whether a vehicle has fire points or not...i would very much like to see this apparant quote from the 3rd ed rulebook though! it can't have been ture or else tau fire warriors would have been allowed to fire from insde their devilfishes!

You were saying about Tau having an edge over eldar? now that would have been just ridiculous!

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Old 02 Apr 2005, 15:02   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Whats Wrong With The Eldar?

I haven't got a third edition rulebook as you well know but don't worry - I assure you that you will get your quote.

However I am by no means saying that the rule change is right or wrong. I am merely saying that it has changed from 'x' to 'y' and 'y' puts Eldar at a bigger disadvantage than 'x' did.
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