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Eldar Guardians - The Forgotten Warriors?
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Old 14 Mar 2005, 13:37   #1 (permalink)
Ethereal
 
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Default Eldar Guardians - The Forgotten Warriors?

There have been plenty of threads on the use of Aspect Warriors and Troop Transports, but few that I can remember that focus on the mainstay unit (for most Craftworlds anyway) of the Eldar army: Guardians!

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These guys are called GUARDIANS. What does the word 'Guardian' suggest? When I hear it I think of powerful gate keepers, body guards, resolute and unerring in their defense of whatever objective they have been assigned to. But nowdays, when people hear the word 'Guardian', they think of a small elf in plastic armour with a short ranged gun who runs away from anything from a human grunt to an oversized dog. Is this really how Eldar Guardians are? Hell no.

I tend to use large amounts of them because the ability to get large numbers of troops into position quickly can be the deciding factor in a battle. They also look cool, and offer great oppertunities for conversion! Some of the older Guardian models are really classic and look great when incorporated into a Guardian squad. I am hoping that when the new Eldar Codex is released Guardians will be given more freedom of choice when it comes to picking weapons and wargear (remember the Guardians with powerswords?). Storm Guardians make nice specialist squads but the limited number of special weapons in a squad (two) and the inability to use interesting close combat weapons (biting blades, power weapons etc) is really dissapointing and is too restricting IMO.[/td][/tr][/table]

I hate seeing them used as 'meatshields', as this:

#1. Makes a mockery of the Eldar fluff (and shows a lack of respect for these warriors! ).
#2. Reinforces the idea of Guardians as useless.
#3. Is a waste of points.
#4. Doesn't actually tend to work very well, especially with the 4th Ed. rules.


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Although I do think it's ok to use them to defend targets or hold areas. I often use them to support my Support Weapon platforms, or assist my Seer Council/Wraithguard, but I don't just stand them in the way to absorb fire, Wraithlords are far more suited to taking flak.

So, do you tend to use Guardians, or avoid them? And if you use them, what techniques and tactics to you employ to make them most effective on the battlefield?
Also, hobby wise, do you like the models, or their image? And do you have any conversions?[/td]
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Remember this quote:
"Our Black Guardians are an impenetrable gate, a metaphorical wall of spears, the gauntlet of our salvation. Each Guardian strenthens the grip with which the ancient and magnificent Eldar are pulling themselves back into power, and they will not give up, they will never break."
- Restayvien, Farseer of Ulthwe; spoken at the Great Hall of Seeing; addressing Black Guardians in preperation for an incursion into Imperial terretory."[/td][td]
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Old 14 Mar 2005, 14:45   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Eldar Guardians - The Forgotten Warriors?

I like the guardian models. I like how you can make 'em into so many poses without having to cut up the model. Since my army isn't big enough yet, I can't comment on how they are in battle and the like.
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Old 14 Mar 2005, 14:59   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Eldar Guardians - The Forgotten Warriors?

I agree, I like the different poses you can achieve. The way the model is divided makes adding extra parts etc easier too.
Fair enough, everyone starts somewhere.
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Old 14 Mar 2005, 21:59   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Eldar Guardians - The Forgotten Warriors?

again, i don't actually played eldar, but i've played against a pretty bad eldar player. He only fields a squad of them and they always get killed...a pie plate on them duz the trick! But how do you use guardians well? I mean, bad armor, bad gun (IMO anyway...maybe i'm spoiled by pulse rifles ) fair ws and bs...they sure don't seem that good unless you're gonna horde them like impguard, which, as i understand it, the eldar don't have the numbers to field, fluffwise, anyway. So how do you use guardians well?
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aw... he's so cute... wha?... a gun?....nice kitty.... nice kitty.... BOOM!
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Old 14 Mar 2005, 23:22   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Eldar Guardians - The Forgotten Warriors?

You could use them for defence, such as holding a table corner excetera, since then the enemy would have to come toward them, and face *insert squad number here* x 2 shots, which, depending on the unit size, could hurt. Especially if you had a squad of twenty, 40 shots. THat'd be cool. Fell free to correct me if I'm wrong.
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Old 15 Mar 2005, 05:31   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Eldar Guardians - The Forgotten Warriors?

I must admit I love guardians. Their short ranged weaponary does agitate me.... but I get over it. I usually use them to hold objectives or to simply hold my flank... I usually play a tau player who deep stirkes lots of suites and a Nid player who charges up the field so IMO the guardians provide an invauable defence. When lead by a warlock with conceal, and equipped with a weapon platform the squad can quickly become a menace on the field. At the moment I only own 20 of them but in the not too distant future I am planning on getting another boxed set.

By the way Restayvien, great work there. I had recently douting buying that boxed set of guardians but now I definetely want them! I really thought the pictures added a nice touch. Once again, well done.
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Old 15 Mar 2005, 12:51   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Eldar Guardians - The Forgotten Warriors?

Quote:
Originally Posted by stealth_cat_xv15
again, i don't actually played eldar, but i've played against a pretty bad eldar player. He only fields a squad of them and they always get killed...a pie plate on them duz the trick! But how do you use guardians well? I mean, bad armor, bad gun (IMO anyway...maybe i'm spoiled by pulse rifles ) fair ws and bs...they sure don't seem that good unless you're gonna horde them like impguard, which, as i understand it, the eldar don't have the numbers to field, fluffwise, anyway. So how do you use guardians well?
One squad? Which Craftworld does he collect (if any)?
Guardian's armour isn't too bad considering their points cost, and with Conceal they can become pretty tough.
Say they're fired at by 10 Marines, and for the sake of argument we'll say they're within rapid-fire range.
20 Boltgun shots , 10 hit.
They cause 5 wounds.
With Conceal (and a bit of luck) only 2 or 3 of those will actually fall.

Their guns are fairly short ranged yes, but they are assault 2. That means you can move 6" and fire twice up to twelve inches. Technically that's an effective range of 18" with two shots, which isn't too bad, especially as Strength 4.
Black Guardians (Ulthwe) become BS4, which means they have as much chance of hitting as a Marine.

So in a squad of 20. That's 6" movement, and then 40 shots at strenth 4. On average 20 will hit, and even against marines that's about 7/8 wounds. If those Guardians are 'Guided', and have Conceal. That's a pretty nasty squad!
Bear in mind I have about 68 in my army.
Also, in an Ulthwe army at least, lots of Guardians does fit the fluff!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Freeman
By the way Restayvien, great work there. I had recently douting buying that boxed set of guardians but now I definetely want them! I really thought the pictures added a nice touch. Once again, well done.
Thanks!
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Old 15 Mar 2005, 20:42   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Eldar Guardians - The Forgotten Warriors?

As I understand it, his force is supposed to represent an Eldar pirate group but he uses the Ulthwe rules, I guess cuz he likes them.*
And I dunno...I still don't like Shruiken Catapults.* But then, I play Tau and am used to Pulse Rifles, so I suppose that's no surprise.
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Originally Posted by Wood Gecko (Diplodactylus Vittatus)
aw... he's so cute... wha?... a gun?....nice kitty.... nice kitty.... BOOM!
"Strategy is finding an s-o-b whom you rank and telling him to take a place, and relieving him if he doesn't." ~General George Patton
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Old 16 Mar 2005, 13:38   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Eldar Guardians - The Forgotten Warriors?

Being Biel Tan, I never use many guardians. I field a biel tan core army host, preferring the Dire Avengers to Guardians, if I go vanilla, as my core units. This punish my playing style, as I cannot field as great numbers, but it hurts every time I remove an eldar, so their 5+ save is incompatible with my style. I dont like them to die all that quickly, and facing alot of imperial guard, I'll rather go with a 4+ save of the aspect warriors. And I find that this fits perfectly well into my view (fluff?) of my army. I have a small squad, which I use as a heavy weapon squad, so theyre never that numerous.

My vanilla troops are always rangers, avengers and more avengers... Or if biel tan, its mostly Reapers, Avengers and banshees... Which also works ok...

I hate to just remove casualties all the time, unless I play orks. Then my mobs fall with joy and fun... ;D
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Old 16 Mar 2005, 13:42   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Eldar Guardians - The Forgotten Warriors?

I collect an Uthwe army, and as such have to take Gaurdian squads, but i dont mind taking them, i usualy take as many as i can.
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